Exclusive Deal

While supplies last, save 40% off over 40 iPhone 5 and iPhone 4/4S cases and chargers as well as Samsung S III cases at Kensington.com. Use coupon code 'SAVE40%' at checkout to receive this exclusive discount.

toggle

AAPL Stock: 445.15 ( + 3.01 )

MacNN News

http://www.macnn.com/articles/01/06/21/developer.talks/

Developer talks OS X speed issues

updated 03:30 am EDT, Thu June 21, 2001

", 0, 0);

Sam Grinter notes an article by Andrew Welch of Ambrosia Software about OS X speed issues: "I believe that Apple understands that OS X's speed is a problem. Steve Jobs stood up at the WWDC (a developer's conference) this year, and stated that speed was the number one complaint and concern about OS X. I think it is fair to say that if Jobs is making a statement like that in public, to Apple's developers, that there's been a fire lit..."

by MacNN Staff

Post tools:

TAGS :

industry

toggle

Comments

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 04:41am | report spam | close Reply | delete
You should have heard.

It was even more alarming when the slide of the "No more CRT's ;(" came up. The audience started murmuring in what I thought was a bit of dissaproval, but leave it to Steve, he did invent the cube after all.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 08:28am | report spam | close Reply | delete
LCD's make sense

On the actual topic, it's not OS X's speed, but the perceived speed of the user interface. Quartz is slow right now and if Apple figures out how to only how to enable hardware acceleration for PDF, the perceived speed of OS X will get a swift kick in the pants.

On the subject of no more CRT's...
The cube may not have had as wide of an appeal as they wanted, but LCD's are really hot now. How many of you REALLY wanted an LCD when they came out, because you were tired of wrestling with the heft of 17-21" monitors? So they don't register the colors as well as a CRT, you can always buy one from someone else.

I think that Apple is trying to be a standard bearer, the first to stop supplying power and space hungry CRT's. It fit's with their enviro-friendly and PC (as in politically cleansed) image because power is conserved (CA) and recycling is easier and safer with LCD's than it is with CRT's.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 10:36am | report spam | close Reply | delete
Love the LCDs

But I can't plug one into my Titanium PowerBook.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 10:58am | report spam | close Reply | delete
Re: Love the LCDs

Yes, you can plug one into our PowerBook...it just costs extra for an adapter. Too bad Apple doesn't provide one of these as a less exensive bundle.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 11:04am | report spam | close Reply | delete
How??

Yes, you can plug one into our PowerBook...

Um, no you cant... you show me an analog VGA to digital ADC switch and I will s*** a purple twinkie right here...

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 11:35am | report spam | close Reply | delete
Re: How??

Griffin is producing one. I don't know if it's available yet, but they are doing it.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 11:40am | report spam | close Reply | delete
Do you really need one?

True, an adapter can only scale down in technology, not up. So while a digital video port can run VGA monitor, a VGA port will never run a digital monitor.

However, you have a Ti Powerbook! Geez, how big of a screen do you want? Besides, your better off getting a cheaper VGA screen from another company since your VGA port would never put out the quality picture the Apple digital LCDs are capable of.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 11:45am | report spam | close Reply | delete
Only the GUI is slow

There is nothing "slow" about the underlying BSD subsystem. The "basics" of OS X are up to speed... they just have some work to do on Quartz.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 12:17pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
It's all slow

If the GUI was the only thing that was slow, raytracing in Lightwave 6.5b wouldn't be slower in OS X. It is much slower. I have yet to see any benchmarks from OS X that are as fast as OS 9.

I own Freehand 10, which is a Carbon application. It's much slower than the OS 9 version (and buggy too).

Every single browser I have used in OS X is MUCH slower than the OS 9 version. OmniWeb is a Cocoa application and is a perfect example of what the president of Ambrosia was saying - Cocoa doesn't mean speed. OmniWeb is dog slow - pretty, but dog slow.

I have read a statement about the beta of Premiere 6 for OS X rendering up to 3X as fast as the OS 9 version. If this is true, we have hope.

OpenGL IS much faster in OS X. I play Heavy Metal and Quake III and they run really well in OS X. Much better than OS 9. However, games like Unreal Tournament, Deus Ex, Rune, and others all use Rave. Will these games even be ported to OS X?

Who cares if FreeBSD is fast? OS X is very slow on a 1 gig RAM dual G4 500 system. This has got to change within the next year. Otherwise I will be forced to get a very fast PC, unless Windows XP is also really slow. I read that they recommend at least an 800 Mhz PIII for it.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 01:31pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Better start squeezing...

that purple twinkie out of your a**, because Griffen DOES make a analog VGA to digital ADC adapter, they ship it, and I have seen it work!

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 01:41pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
slow on Dual?

Not at all! My Dual 533 run OS X so damn well that it's up to speed as OS 9 if not faster. That almost make me believe OS X should run on a dual system :-)

The Quartz engine should optimize. But hey, I run it on a Pismo 400 and it's well acceptable. And again, on my Dual, it just FAST!!!!!!

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 02:19pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Re: It's All Slow

If the GUI was the only thing that was slow, raytracing in
Lightwave 6.5b wouldn't be slower in OS X. It is much slower. I have yet to see any benchmarks from OS X that are as fast as OS9

Sounds like 2D rendering which would be dependant on the Quartz API which is not fully optimized. The only difference between this and the GUI is that the rendering is being done off screen

Cocoa doesn't mean speed. OmniWeb is dog slow - pretty, but dog
slow.

Cocoa uses objective-c which is a dynamic language, but from my understanding means that it will always be a little slower than c due to its dynamic capabilities.

I have read a statement about the beta of Premiere 6 for OS X rendering up to 3X as fast as the OS 9 version

They have probably been testing it with builds of 10.1 since it won't be out before July.

Who cares if FreeBSD is fast? OS X is very slow on a 1 gig RAM dual G4 500 system

Most of the speed problems with MacOS X revolve around unoptimized code. As Apple improves the port of gcc for MacOS X and works to optimize and accelerate Quartz I think that you should see very vast improvements. The hardest part is done in that they have a fast and stable base with FreeBSD everything else will come in time.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 02:19pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
slooooow

OSX is dog slow no question about it. I have only found ftp to be faster. reports are that opengl is faster. multitasking is better than os9 but is still weak compared to my win2K machine. Apple had better pull one huge rabbit out there a** to make this upgrade worthwhile.

1) speed mostly slower
2) multitasking maybe better but still sux
3) stability awesome

OSX is fucked for the next year.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 02:19pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Re: It's All Slow

If the GUI was the only thing that was slow, raytracing in
Lightwave 6.5b wouldn't be slower in OS X. It is much slower. I have yet to see any benchmarks from OS X that are as fast as OS9

Sounds like 2D rendering which would be dependant on the Quartz API which is not fully optimized. The only difference between this and the GUI is that the rendering is being done off screen

Cocoa doesn't mean speed. OmniWeb is dog slow - pretty, but dog
slow.

Cocoa uses objective-c which is a dynamic language, but from my understanding means that it will always be a little slower than c due to its dynamic capabilities.

I have read a statement about the beta of Premiere 6 for OS X rendering up to 3X as fast as the OS 9 version

They have probably been testing it with builds of 10.1 since it won't be out before July.

Who cares if FreeBSD is fast? OS X is very slow on a 1 gig RAM dual G4 500 system

Most of the speed problems with MacOS X revolve around unoptimized code. As Apple improves the port of gcc for MacOS X and works to optimize and accelerate Quartz I think that you should see very vast improvements. The hardest part is done in that they have a fast and stable base with FreeBSD everything else will come in time.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 02:54pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
cd ejection

Am I the only one that has trouble ejecting CD's???
Lately, I've tried to press the eject button in iTunes and the spinning rainbow disk will show up and nothing happens. Then I try dragging the CD to the trash and the spinning disk shows up in the finder and then I can't do anything anymore. I have to manually eject the CD by pressing the little "emergency" button and then restart my powerbook (G3 series)because relaunching the finder doesnt do s***. I'm really disappointed in this OS.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 03:17pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
cd ejection

force quit classic then relaunch the finder...works every time.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 04:23pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Lightwave speed

Raytracing has nothing to do with Quartz. It's the same thing as Mathematica or any other highly math-intensive operation. Rendering isn't a display operation. You don't even display the rendering while it's happening. The point is that this sort of thing is crucial for many applications - After Effects, Cleaner, Lightwave, Cinema 4D, Maya, Premiere, Commotion, Combustion, etc. If Apple wants OS X to bring content creators from Windows, they will need to fix the speed issue.

OS X is slower with every Carbon application I have used that I also own for OS 9, save for OpenGL and networking (FreeBSD at work).

Why it is slower doesn't matter to me or any other consumer. You aren't going to display an iMac with OS X and have a potential customer use it and say "Damn, this OS X Mac is faster than that Windows PC."

I was using OS X as my primary OS since March 24th. But I recently went back to OS 9 and I was startled at the speed of the OS. Everything is faster in OS 9 and I am more productive in it. I really love the OS X UI and like the fact that I don't have to select Hide Others ever. I love not using the desktop. It's a much more productive way of handling windows and files. But OS X is just too slow for me to use as a working OS.

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 04:51pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Better start squeezing...

Where? Where is this adapter? Give me a URL, I will send you a purple twinkie...

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 05:53pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
OS X Multitasking?

2) multitasking maybe better but still sux

Whoa! and what have you been smoking today fella? They's no way OS X's multitasking "sux", or is just a 'tad' better than OS 9! How culud you say that?? the whole multitasking system in oS 9 is completely overhauled in OS X -- completely rewritten and different. and guess what? it is better than in W2K. it might now appear as robust and Win2K's multitalking because in OS X, the system does take a while to draw those beautiful Aqua windows, but in W2k, they's no delay.

plain and simple, jack a**

0

Joined:

0

06/21, 07:28pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
cd ejection

thanks for the help, but classic isnt running when this happens

0

Joined:

0

06/22, 03:14am | report spam | close Reply | delete
UI speed = perception

One thing to consider is that window resizing is not that much faster in OS9. But OS9 FEELS faster because it draws the nice bounding rectangle in a very responsive way, so you know the computer is keeping up--even though no real graphics are being redrawn. On the other hand, OSX does not show you what's going on, so it FEELS slow, even though it is refreshing the whole window more quickly than OS9. Try it in OSX, with one native app, and one classic app, and watch what actually happens when you resize windows. The sense of slowness is due in large part to poor user feedback in OSX.

0

Joined:

0

06/22, 04:44am | report spam | close Reply | delete
OS X vs. Win 2K

Look guys, I love OS X and I love my Macs but Windows 2K is faster, and just like OS X it never ever crashes. (I don't remember the last time I saw the blue screen of death.)

Apple does need to do some serious work (wherever and however) to get the speed up because OS 9 on the same hardware as OS X will beat the pants off of it in terms of speed. As to Windows 2K it beats the pants off it in speed too while having the stability that OS 9 lacks. OS X isn't going to convert anyone at this point.

Just to clarify that I'm not about to ditch my Mac for a PC only world -- I think doing graphics on Win 2K still sucks. Wouldn't trade doing it on my Mac for anything.

0

Joined:

0

06/22, 11:02pm | report spam | close Reply | delete
Speed is relative

OS X and Windows 2000 seem about the same to me as far as speed goes. It's a matter of perspective and expectations much like the difference between cars and sodas. I'll take OS X, Coke, and Chevy's anyday.

Show More Comments

Login Here

toggle

Network Headlines

05/24	Apple seeds eighth OS X 10.8.4 beta...
05/24	Motorola appeals dismissal of ITC complaint...
05/24	Apple cuts prices on refurbished iPads...
05/24	Best Buy to start month-long $50 discount...
05/24	Rain continues to cause problems at...

Show All

05/24	Motorola appeals dismissal of ITC complaint...
05/24	Best Buy to start month-long $50 discount...
05/23	AT&T GoPhone may get iPhone, LTE/HSPA...
05/23	Google posts Chrome 28 beta, integrates...
05/23	Google in 'holding pattern' with Apple...

Show All

03/02	Save $330 on refurb. 15.4-inch, 2.4GHz...
03/01	Pre-owned 8GB iPod touch 2G, drops...
02/29	$150 off Nikon Coolpix S80 Compact...
02/28	Plantronics BackBeat 903 Bluetooth...
02/27	Refurb. Seagate 1.5TB GoFlex Portable...

Show All

toggle

Developer talks OS X speed issues

updated 03:30 am EDT, Thu June 21, 2001

You should have heard.

LCD's make sense

Love the LCDs

Re: Love the LCDs

How??

Re: How??

Do you really need one?

Only the GUI is slow

It's all slow

Better start squeezing...

slow on Dual?

Re: It's All Slow

slooooow

Re: It's All Slow

cd ejection

cd ejection

Lightwave speed

Better start squeezing...

OS X Multitasking?

cd ejection

UI speed = perception

OS X vs. Win 2K

Speed is relative

Login Here

Register for our weekly email newsletter:

Connect tools:

Subscribe

to our RSS

Follow us

on Twitter

Most Read

10 Most Discussed

MacNN Marketplace

Developer talks OS X speed issues

updated 03:30 am EDT, Thu June 21, 2001

Related Articles

Recent Articles

You should have heard.

LCD's make sense

Love the LCDs

Re: Love the LCDs

How??

Re: How??

Do you really need one?

Only the GUI is slow

It's all slow

Better start squeezing...

slow on Dual?

Re: It's All Slow

slooooow

Re: It's All Slow

cd ejection

cd ejection

Lightwave speed

Better start squeezing...

OS X Multitasking?

cd ejection

UI speed = perception

OS X vs. Win 2K

Speed is relative

Login Here

Register for our weekly email newsletter:

Connect tools:

Subscribe

to our RSS

Follow us

on Twitter

Most Read

10 Most Discussed

MacNN Marketplace