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http://www.macnn.com/articles/03/06/16/ms.to/

MS to release IE 5.2.3 for OS X later today

updated 02:50 am EDT, Mon June 16, 2003

", 0, 0);

: "We will, however, continue to support IE 5 and are sharing our compiled understanding of customer requirements with Apple's Safari team, who is working to meet Mac users' future browser needs."

by MacNN Staff

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06/16, 03:02am | report spam | close Reply |
First post!

Oh no, that ound like more IE in Safari, yech.

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06/16, 03:22am | report spam | close Reply |
i for one,

do not give a big damn.

trying to cull my favor eh? suck my big toe MS. and mac BU, for shame! you guys suck.

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06/16, 03:23am | report spam | close Reply |
so what?

so, the obvious question is...who cares?

not me. and not a whole bunch of people who have already found sollace in moz, safari, omni, et all.

blah, this gets more and more pathetic as it goes. way to kick that dead horse MacBU

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06/16, 03:50am | report spam | close Reply |
bye, IE

Read http://rentzsch.com/notes/losingMacIE6 for something more intelligent than the mindless drivel that's posted here nowadays.

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06/16, 05:10am | report spam | close Reply |
That's a thoughtful link

Thanks.

The death of a rendering engine aside, I still think IE sucked and I +hate+ Microsoft.

The rendering engine probably should be "monopolized" with a single, royalty-free open source standard while browser developers should put their focus not on the rendering engine itself but usability and features.

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06/16, 07:29am | report spam | close Reply |
Good riddance MS

MS calls up MacNN and MacMinute to tell them they're releasing some itty bitty maintenance upgrade on this piece of c***? Gee, thanks... wankers.

IE 5 for Mac sucks a**, and this rinky-dink update won't change that.

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06/16, 08:22am | report spam | close Reply |
If they improve...

...the rendering speed so that it matches my similarly priced PC & improves java compatibility so that all sites work it would be a welcome improvement...

I'm also glad to hear that MS will be helping Apple get Safari 'up to speed' as more & more I have to switch to my PC to get sites to load properly...

So much for the 'world-wide' web - MS appears to be winning the battle...

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06/16, 08:35am | report spam | close Reply |
Huh?

"So much for the 'world-wide' web - MS appears to be winning the battle..."

Huh? Microsoft is surrendering the web browser battle on the Mac platform. The battle will continue between Safari, Mozilla bowsers, and possibly Opera, but Microsoft certainly will not be the winner.

On the Intel/AMD PC side, Microsoft has never really competed on the Linux platform and so the only area where they could even potentially be winning the battle is on the Windows platform. However, although they are currently dominate there, all indications are that they are beginning to lose ground. Their recent announcement regarding discontinuation of a stand alone browser indicates that they are not going to make any signifigant changes to the Windows IE browser until Longhorn comes out in 2005. It is almost as if Microsoft has decided that the browser war is not even worth fighting any longer.

They are not winning the war; they are quitting the war.

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06/16, 08:51am | report spam | close Reply |
Bad news

IE is not my favorite browser, but on many sites, it is ALL that will work. Especially since Safari does not have an Opera-like "stealth mode" (i.e. pretending to be IE). Many businesses test to see if you're using IE and if not...SOL.

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06/16, 09:27am | report spam | close Reply |
re:bad news

Safari does have a "stealth mode" and can pretend to be any other browser. You just meed to activate the debug menu (which a number of programs on the net do for you) to activate that feature.

I would be nice if apple allowed it by default though.

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06/16, 10:37am | report spam | close Reply |
bad news

God, some of you people have your head buried in the sand. Any time MS pulls an app from the mac, it's gonna be bad press. Potential windows converts might be scared, it rings that "there's no software for the mac" bell.

Also, corporate users might be particularly screwed who are forced to use IE, or need particular compatibility with sites might also suffer.

Anytime a company drops an app, it's not a good thing. Choice is key.

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06/16, 10:44am | report spam | close Reply |
bye, and don't come back

I deleted IE long time ago.

If I come upon a site that only support IE? Big deal. I would stop visiting them. Simple as that.

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06/16, 10:46am | report spam | close Reply |
who cares ...

about converts. if they are scared with things like this. be it. let them live with windows.

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06/16, 11:02am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: Huh?

On the Intel/AMD PC side, Microsoft has never really competed on the Linux platform and so the only area where they could even potentially be winning the battle is on the Windows platform. However, although they are currently dominate there, all indications are that they are beginning to lose ground.

The "only" area you talk about happens to be 95% of all computer users. So, even throwing out the Mac, they still dominate 90% of all browser usage (taking 5% of PC users off of IE, add in 5% of the 'other' platforms). You seem to give a lot more meaning to the non-windows platforms.

And what indications that they're going to lose ground? I haven't seen any. And they're not going to give it up without a fight.

Their recent announcement regarding discontinuation of a stand alone browser indicates that they are not going to make any signifigant changes to the Windows IE browser until Longhorn comes out in 2005. It is almost as if Microsoft has decided that the browser war is not even worth fighting any longer.

That's bogus. If this is your indicator, your a fool, an idiot, or just don't understand things. Just because there's no more standalone browser doesn't mean IE can't be updated before 2005. Its part of the OS, so they'll update it through OS updates (you know, service packs, update products like WMP, etc). h***, because its all controlled by MS, they can incorporate updates behind the scenes in pretty much any system update, from a critical update to a direct X release.

All MS is doing with their announcement is what they wanted to do 5 years ago, integrate the browser into the OS to control even more of the internet experience, not give up on it.

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06/16, 11:18am | report spam | close Reply |
Another good synopsis

There is another good synopsis at http://www.billstevenson.org/archives/000178.html

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06/16, 11:36am | report spam | close Reply |
Its true

I wish safari can do everything IE can do but the truth is it can't. Its nice to have it as a back up, and at the least we know that it might be compatible with IE for windows. I have several banking sites that just dont liek safari but work well with IE.

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06/16, 11:40am | report spam | close Reply |
mac usage slipping?

I wonder what percentage of os X users actually use IE now. Except perhaps for webdesigners (who we've heard a lot from), I bet the figure is slipping fast with all the other good browsers out there. That would seem like reason enough for M$ to stop its development.

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06/16, 12:18pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: its true

Which also shows how a company with such a large monopoly power can use it in less-than-appropriate ways. Maybe someone should point these arguments to the DOJ, who seemed fit to think that there is no problem with MS.

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06/16, 12:27pm | report spam | close Reply |
Why the whining?

What's the bemoaning of MS's news about IE development being cut off. Maybe you didn't notice, they haven't released a real update in years. Going along with that, its not like you can't use the copy you have (try telling an OS 9 user that the OS won't be updated, and they'll tell you "Who cares! It works, it works well, and I'll use it until OS X acts just like my clunky OS 9!").

And I still would like to know what kind of OS integration a browser really needs. It sounds more like an excuse tied to their reasoning behind integrating it on a PC.

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06/16, 12:40pm | report spam | close Reply |
Oh yeah...

MACNN must be working for Microsoft just like Krakow! The ignorance that goes on at this place...

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06/16, 01:19pm | report spam | close Reply |
re: Stealth mode

Just to note that Safari DOES have a "stealth mode" (ie you can change how it identifies itself to sites).

It's in the hidden "debug" menu, which you can turn on by using Safari Enhancer (free download from the usual places).

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06/16, 01:27pm | report spam | close Reply |
I for one am REALLY sorry

I am so sick and tired of reading (often mindless) and poorly thought through responses on these threads. ANY developement for the Mac whether you choose in your ignorance to use it or not IS GOOD FOR OUR PLATFORM.
ESPECIALLY if it from a corporation such as Microsoft. In this day and age where we are becoming increasingly niched, it gives the platform of our choice C-R-E-D-I-B-I-L-I-T-Y.
Understand? Credibility is what will convince more people to switch to Mac. The more people that switch to Mac, means a broader user base. A broader user base means more software developers and more, better software.
I just wish we as the Mac user group was represented by less idiots, and deeper thinkers.
Richfunk

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06/16, 02:05pm | report spam | close Reply |
Intelligence

Ok, here's a marginally intelligent post:

First, at least of fairly professional Mac users (the type who read MacEdition, that is), this CodeBitch article shows some OSX browser statistics:

http://www.macedition.com/cb/cb_20030602.php

Since the release of Safari, IE use has gone from 40% to less than 10% (and that is down from 70% a mere year and a half ago).

The type of Mac users to whom web browsing means a lot, and who follow software, obviously don't like IE, and the uneducated masses will probably use Safari eventually anyway, due to OS upgrades.

On a personal level, I don't care that IE won't be developed further. I essentially never used it anyway, don't like MS, and in the handful of situations I did need it, I can still use the one I've got (and you can still download it--they did say "continue to support", after all).

All that said, I wish they were supporting it. Having an extra rendering engine to throw at a really badly written page that you just need to use is a good thing. I prefer to just not patronize badly written pages, but occasionally you have little choice. And probably more importantly, as a web designer, it was nice having a browser with something resembling IE/Win rendering without using VPC.

In fact, I really, REALLY wish that the USDOJ would've required them to make a version of IE that used the same rendering engine as the newest PC version available on the MacOS (and Linux--why not). Aside from the guaranteed, just-in-case site compabibility, that'd make doing a basic "IE OK?" test for web designers ever so much easier. You'd still need to use VPC or a PC to be sure when it really counted, but a quick check for spot-checking or when you don't care is helpful.

Of course, the current version of IE didn't do to well on that front, either, but it's rendering engine had some quirks in common with the Win version, enough to make it worth poking a page design with.

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06/16, 02:10pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: Huh?

" The "only" area you talk about happens to be 95% of all computer users. So, even throwing out the Mac, they still dominate 90% of all browser usage (taking 5% of PC users off of IE, add in 5% of the 'other' platforms). You seem to give a lot more meaning to the non-windows platforms."

Actually, I don't mean to nitpick or anything, but you're forgetting the huge number of browsers that actually spoof their identity to make webservers _think_ they're IE to get things working. My guesstimate would be about 70-80% browser average for IE...

Which brings me to the other reader suggesting Apple make it easier for Safari to spoof its identity: Webmasters look at their webserver logs to see what their visitors use to visit their site. If everybody fakes an IE browser, then webmasters see a huge majority of M$IE, and will stop trying to be standards compliant, and will go with what renders in IE only.
It might be a better idea for every alternative-browser user to email these webmasters, and tell them their code doesn't comply with the w3c standards (there's an automated code validator at www.w3c.org to test sites for bad HTML)

Just my 2 cents...
Cheers!

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06/16, 03:01pm | report spam | close Reply |
Yeah right...

"you're forgetting the huge number of browsers that actually spoof their identity to make webservers _think_ they're IE to get things working. My guesstimate would be about 70-80% browser average for IE..."

No we are not, dipshit. How many people do you think have the knowledge of modifying their browser to spoof? According to you that is 15% to 25% of the internet population - and that is how many million people? You are an idiot!

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06/16, 03:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
What's up with MSN OSX?

I could be mistaken here, but MacEdition seems to think that the new version of the MSN browser for OSX is way, way more powerful than even IE6 for Windows. And, it exists now.

I think that means it's pretty obvious that's where IE Mac 6 ended up, and it seems a pity that they won't be giving it to those of us who wouldn't give MS $10 a month if they threatened to shave our heads and force us to wear purple pants. Guess MS doesn't mind giving us their best, so long as we pay for it.

Aside from the fact that that sucks (and the MBU probably would've embarassed the IE Win guys by making a point of a browser that kicked their sorry a**), that makes me wonder if maybe the next rev of IE Win will have these features, in which case WHY CAN'T A WEB DEVELOPER GET A VERSION TO TEST WITH WITHOUT GETTING MSN?! Heck, restrict it to local pages if you're that paranoid.

Even WebTV had a Mac-compatible test browser, so you could chkeck out design without buying a WebTV box--you can still download it from MS's site, in fact.

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06/16, 03:49pm | report spam | close Reply |
MS is not stopping IE dev

MS is not stopping IE development for MacOS X - They are only stopping development for the STAND-ALONE MacOS X IE. IE6 for MacOS X already exists and is available - It is imbedded into MSN-for-MacOS-X (look at the way it identifies itself to the Web Server).

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06/16, 03:50pm | report spam | close Reply |
MS is not stopping IE dev

MS is not stopping IE development for MacOS X - They are only stopping development for the STAND-ALONE MacOS X IE. IE6 for MacOS X already exists and is available - It is imbedded into MSN-for-MacOS-X (look at the way it identifies itself to the Web Server).

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06/17, 05:38am | report spam | close Reply |
Typical

When Microsoft starts losing marketshare it quits. What a bunch of monopolist babies!

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MS to release IE 5.2.3 for OS X later today

updated 02:50 am EDT, Mon June 16, 2003

Related Articles

Recent Articles

First post!

i for one,

so what?

bye, IE

That's a thoughtful link

Good riddance MS

If they improve...

Huh?

Bad news

re:bad news

bad news

bye, and don't come back

who cares ...

Re: Huh?

Another good synopsis

Its true

mac usage slipping?

Re: its true

Why the whining?

Oh yeah...

re: Stealth mode

I for one am REALLY sorry

Intelligence

Re: Huh?

Yeah right...

What's up with MSN OSX?

MS is not stopping IE dev

MS is not stopping IE dev

Typical

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