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http://www.macnn.com/articles/09/02/16/pearc.maker.unafraid/

German Mac clone builder "not afraid" of Apple

updated 10:55 am EST, Mon February 16, 2009

PearC maker unafraid

HyperMegaNet is not worried about any legal threats from Apple, according to company spokesman Dirk Bloessl. The German builder is currently selling the PearC line, a series of PCs which have the option of Mac OS X Leopard as an alternative to Windows; Leopard's EULA strictly forbids installing the OS on non-Apple hardware. Should Apple initiate a lawsuit, Bloessl notes that HyperMegaNet will first try to settle outside of court. "But if necessary," Bloessl adds, "we are not afraid of going to court with Apple."

Apple's primary legal obstacle is said to be the availability of the EULA, as it can only be read after someone has already bought Leopard, or a Mac with the OS pre-installed. German law dictates that restrictions cannot be imposed after a product has been sold, according to Bloessl. The point could thus render Leopard's license agreement entirely meaningless within Germany, permitting unhindered Mac cloning.

Apple is currently embroiled in legal entanglements with Psystar, an American clone builder. While EULAs can be enforced within the US, Psystar has launched a countersuit, accusing Apple of pushing copyright provisions too far in order to prevent legitimate competition. Barring an early settlement, the Psystar case is only scheduled to go to trial November 9th.

by MacNN Staff

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TAGS :

computers, Leopard, Mac OS X, HyperMegaNet, PearC

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Comments

b9robot
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2009

-15

02/16, 11:24am | report spam | close Reply |
EULA is posted BEFORE you

EULA is posted BEFORE you INSTALL. And I don't believe it matters where it is. It still forbids use on anything other than a Macintosh. And Apple also has exclusive rights to sell it unless the company has written contract with Apple to do so.
Two points that they SHOULD BE WORRIED ABOUT. But as the saying goes, STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES. There big words in print will not help them in court.

Jonathan-Tanya
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2004

+3

02/16, 11:28am | report spam | close Reply |
install doesn't matter

b9robot.

The question is not when you install it, but when you buy it.

Since you don't know German law, you had nothing to add to this story.

Johnny Niles
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2007

0

02/16, 11:31am | report spam | close Reply |
EULA available pre-sale

Apple's EULA for OS X is available to read on their web site before you even buy OS X. If HyperMegaNet pushes this, they will lose.

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

-2

02/16, 12:08pm | report spam | close Reply |
so....

your saying german law allows to break any EULA from any company? Apple will prevail in this lawsuit when its filed. Guess german law allows this sort of stealing to produce jobs.

rytc
Senior User

Joined: Jan 2001

+6

02/16, 12:21pm | report spam | close Reply |
German law

German law states that the rules of use must be clearly shown before the product is purchased and they can't then be altered. However, all this anti-German rhetoric unless anyone here actually knows the actual law is wasted breath. I find it hard to believe that no one has thought of this before which would suggest these people have nothing to stand on. Besides, knowingly selling things that break the EULA without informing the purchaser would to me suggest the person at fault would be the seller.

jpellino
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 1999

0

02/16, 12:23pm | report spam | close Reply |
Precedent

There was another German, name of Roy, who wasn't afraid of tigers. That didn't work out so well either.

aaalexxx
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2009

+4

02/16, 12:33pm | report spam | close Reply |
Windows OEM

Hi there,

fact is that certain portions of EULAs are now valid in Germany and other European countries. For example Microsoft Windows OEM versions. They come with your computer and are not to be sold separately, that's why the sticker is on the pc. However, as far as I know, German law says that, since you bought the software, you can do what you want with it. That's why many people sell OEM versions of MS Windows on eBay - scraped off sticker included.

To me this seems quite similar to the "I sell a brand new computer and an original Mac OS with it"-story...

Mr. Strat
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2002

0

02/16, 12:36pm | report spam | close Reply |
Just what we need...

Just what the market needs, more scam artists. I hope these guys end up bankrupt along with Psystar.

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

+3

02/16, 01:03pm | report spam | close Reply |
Apple is not helping

Since Apple has seemingly abandoned the mac mini (ya, I know the update is coming. Heard that for years) and does not offer a less expensive desktop these companies are filling that need. Apple needs to take that market themselves.

nativeNYer
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Apr 2005

+3

02/16, 01:39pm | report spam | close Reply |
Legal or not

Legal or not in Germany or elsewhere, the thing that bothers me most about companies like Psystar and HyperMegaNet (retarded name) is that none of these sham companies are remotely interested in advancing the Mac platform the way the legit cloners were back in the 90s. Sure, business is business and PowerComputing, DayStar, Umax and others were out to make money like all companies, but they at least had an interest in the Mac and seeing it grow. Remember, these companies signed on to make clones back in the dark days of Apple bleeding red. It was risky venture back then, but they had faith in it.

These guys and Psystar are only attempting to cash in on the newfound popularity of the Mac platform, all the while trashing and bad mouthing Apple (in Psystar's case at least). Basically they are what I would call "fair weather crooks". If Apple suddenly went out of business tomorrow, they likely wouldn't shed a single tear, except that they would lose a potential revenue source. They'd just move on to ripping off some other companies IP to make a buck.

So, whether they win or Psystar wins or both, we will see a dramatic change in the Mac platform from Apple. These jokers aren't considering the long term health of Apple Inc, only their short term monetary goals.

ctt1wbw
Mac Elite

Joined: Jan 2001

-1

02/16, 02:22pm | report spam | (1 reply) close Reply |
Well...

I'm going to start building cars that look EXACTLY like BMWs. I'm even going to have the official logo on the cars, too. I'm not afraid of BMW and their legal team.

manleycreative
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Sep 2005

+5

02/16, 02:50pm | report spam | close Reply |
Brass baby!

Wow, these cloner folks are getting some balls all of a sudden.

Foe Hammer
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2005

+3

02/16, 03:03pm | report spam | close Reply |
Peanuts?

I'm sure my chihuahua would not be afraid an elephant. But that doesn't mean he'd survive a stomping from said elephant.

Johnny Niles
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2007

+3

02/16, 03:42pm | report spam | close Reply |
Again

Since somebody seems to be going through low ranking comments that explain why Apple is going to win without putting up a counter argument, I'll say this again.

Anybody can read the EULA for OS X on Apple's web site BEFORE OS X IS PURCHASED. Therefore, if HyperMegaNet wants to follow through in court, they will lose.

Case closed. Next!

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

-5

02/16, 03:47pm | report spam | (1 reply) close Reply |
Re: Again

Sorry, but your argument is completely invalid. If you are in a store and see MacOS X, is the buyer, after looking at the box, supposed to go "Hmmm, I bet there's a EULA to this. I better put this down, go home, read it on my computer, and then decide whether I accept it, then come back."

Yeah, and that's assuming they have a way at home to access the internet to get to the EULA.

If this is going to be your argument, then any company can claim they can't be at fault for anything, since all they need to do is put some disclaimers on a web site somewhere.

Oh, and could you point out the section of German law that states that a EULA posted on a web-site is valid in such a case?

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

-12

02/16, 03:55pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: legal or not

is that none of these sham companies are remotely interested in advancing the Mac platform the way the legit cloners were back in the 90s.

What were you smoking back then? Those cloners had NO desire to advance the Mac platform. Why do you think cloning died? It was due to the simple fact that all they ended up doing was steal Apple's customers, instead of going out and getting more.

And what makes you say they have no desire to advance the mac platform now? They're trying to sell mac computers to those who cannot afford apple's prices (because not everyone has $2700 to get a computer that will allow you to get an esata access).

The problem here, as it was in the mid-90s, is that, except for the "I've got to buy Apple regardless of price because it looks so darned good" crowd, there's a lot of people who would buy a clone as a 'good enough' alternative at a much lower price.

And it also seems to me that, if there's an actual market for these computers, then that suggests that Apple may be missing out on a lot of sales due to their limited product line-up.

And if there isn't a big market, then it doesn't matter, does it.

If Apple suddenly went out of business tomorrow, they likely wouldn't shed a single tear, except that they would lose a potential revenue source.

And if Apple went out of business tomorrow, you'd be calling these guys up to see if they were still selling computers you could run OS X on.

These jokers aren't considering the long term health of Apple Inc

Yes, because, as we all know, getting MORE customers to use Apple products is a BAD thing.

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

+4

02/16, 05:10pm | report spam | close Reply |
Huh?

What I don't get is this part in the article:
"The point could thus render Leopard's license agreement entirely meaningless within Germany, permitting unhindered Mac cloning."

I would expect that just plain copyright would kick in and prevent that. A lot of things in the Mac OS and the Mac hardware are under copyright. Why would a EULA not being valid (An EULA gives rights that you otherwise would not have) allow unlimited copying?

My version of Mac OS X Leopard comes with a warning on the outside of the box that an EULA is connected to the use of the product.
I would expect the same kind of line on a German retail box (Mine was in Dutch on a Dutch retail copy).
I would also expect that the retailer is required by Apple to have a hardcopy version of the EULA.
The buyer could then request to read this hardcopy version from the sales person.

Also, how does this work with software sold by a web store? (e.g. Amazon.de) The buyer cannot see the EULA of the software here...
I just checked the Amazon site, no EULA present at the page of Norton Internet Security 2009 (Just the first pick).
So, according to HyperMegaNet I am allowed to just copy this software for free in Germany?

Pieter.

aristotles
Grizzled Veteran

Joined: Jul 2004

0

02/16, 08:32pm | report spam | close Reply |
Amazon is not the owner

Apple, as the copyright holder provides the EULA free of charge on their website for anyone to read before purchasing the software. Do you hypocrites expect download.com to display the license of GPL'ed software "before" you download? No, of course not. It's your own responsibility to read the terms and conditions before entering into any binding contract. This applies to both GPL'ed and proprietary software. Apple has fulfilled its legal obligations by providing download links to their EULA as has MSFT with every version of windows released. These judges need to go back to school and learn some basic Internet search skills.

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

-3

02/17, 07:47am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: Huh?

I would expect that just plain copyright would kick in and prevent that. A lot of things in the Mac OS and the Mac hardware are under copyright. Why would a EULA not being valid (An EULA gives rights that you otherwise would not have) allow unlimited copying?

That would be true, but what does copyright have to do with cloning? There is no violation of copyright to take an OS and install it on a computer without permission. If it were, you wouldn't need the EULA. The EULA has been added to try to restrict user rights with regards to purchasing copyrighted materials.

It would be similar to buying a book that had a statement saying you couldn't read it using a Snuggie book light.

nat
Junior Member

Joined: Mar 2002

+2

02/17, 09:13am | report spam | close Reply |
hmmmm

"is currently selling the PearC line, a series of PCs which have the option of Mac OS X Leopard as an alternative to Windows"

two questions:
does that option for leopard mean installed? if so then the seller would seem to be the one breaking the eula.

do they have a license to resell os X?
i'm sure there's no law that says i can't sell my copy of leopard but if i buy 100 thousand copies and start reselling them what's my legal ground to do so?

and third, testudo, shut up. your posts are filled with counter arguments that are every bit as much speculation as those you reply to. once again, YOUR F*&CKING GUESS'S ARE NO MORE VALID THAN ANYONE ELSE'S! i could reply with a long a** post to yours countering your speculations with my own. but what's the frickin point? just shut up.

MiMiC
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2007

+2

02/17, 10:54am | report spam | close Reply |
Full vs. Upgrade

Again, i ask 'if Apple only sells upgrade software, how does anyone install this version as a Full version?

Unless i'm wrong?? Apple's retail version should check for the proper legal previous version before upgrading. This should be all the legal leg they need.

If not, Apple should then sell the Full version for $499 and the upgrade (current version) for the current price.

aristotles
Grizzled Veteran

Joined: Jul 2004

0

02/17, 12:48pm | report spam | close Reply |
MiMiC are you faking it?

Or are you really that clueless? Where in any law does it say that a software developer must code a check for a previous version on an upgrade version? It's called the honour system much in the same way that Apple does not require CD keys on any of it's current CD/DVD distributed products.

What exactly are you looking for? CD keys? Activation?

I don't see how you could be confused as to which version it is given the list price of 129.00 versus 179.99 for Vista Ultimate SP1 Upgrade especially considering how small mac marketshare is compared with windows.

rytc
Senior User

Joined: Jan 2001

-1

02/17, 02:32pm | report spam | close Reply |
Apple

Apple doesn't only sell upgrades what are you talking about?

cebritt
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2000

+1

02/17, 03:25pm | report spam | close Reply |
Win Battle, Lose War

Okay, so this dumb German company wins round one. All Apple has to do is make the necessary changes in Snow Leopard and they're screwed. Who's going to buy a PC with an OS that can't be upgraded? Heck, it sounds like Apple just needs to change the packaging and these guys are screwed.

As for Psystar, Apple just needs to increase the price of a full-install version of Mac OS X to $599...and include a free Mac mini...

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

+1

02/18, 12:06pm | report spam | close Reply |
Like I've been saying!...

F*ck Apple for their Imperial battle on a SUPPOSEDLY "open-source" format!

Stupid hipocracy!

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

0

02/26, 01:08pm | report spam | close Reply |
Best of luck to 'em

I fail to understand why so many people are so eager to be ripped off by the scallies at Crapple.
Their products are NOT as good as they say they are, and they charge ridiculous amounts of cash for standard components.
I can only applaud the efforts of smaller companies to make a product that's reasonably priced.
OK, they might not LOOK as good, but if I want something that LOOKS nice, I'll put a picture on my wall.

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German Mac clone builder "not afraid" of Apple

updated 10:55 am EST, Mon February 16, 2009

PearC maker unafraid

EULA is posted BEFORE you

install doesn't matter

EULA available pre-sale

so....

German law

Precedent

Windows OEM

Just what we need...

Apple is not helping

Legal or not

Well...

Brass baby!

Peanuts?

Again

Re: Again

Re: legal or not

Huh?

Amazon is not the owner

Re: Huh?

hmmmm

Full vs. Upgrade

MiMiC are you faking it?

Apple

Win Battle, Lose War

Like I've been saying!...

Best of luck to 'em

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German Mac clone builder "not afraid" of Apple

updated 10:55 am EST, Mon February 16, 2009

PearC maker unafraid

Related Articles

Recent Articles

EULA is posted BEFORE you

install doesn't matter

EULA available pre-sale

so....

German law

Precedent

Windows OEM

Just what we need...

Apple is not helping

Legal or not

Well...

Brass baby!

Peanuts?

Again

Re: Again

Re: legal or not

Huh?

Amazon is not the owner

Re: Huh?

hmmmm

Full vs. Upgrade

MiMiC are you faking it?

Apple

Win Battle, Lose War

Like I've been saying!...

Best of luck to 'em

Login Here

Register for our weekly email newsletter:

Connect tools:

Subscribe

to our RSS

Follow us

on Twitter

Most Read

10 Most Discussed

MacNN Marketplace