Giveaway: Bracketron Case

If outdoor adventures are in your future this summer, enter to win a Bracketron Sport Case with Mount Strap from MacNN and keep that iPhone, iPod or other electronic device safe from the elements.

toggle

AAPL Stock: 454.74 ( + 1.77 )

MacNN News

http://www.macnn.com/articles/08/05/13/quarkxpress.8.vs.cs3/

QuarkXPress 8 to take dead aim at Adobe CS3?

updated 04:05 pm EDT, Tue May 13, 2008

QuarkXPress 8 vs. CS3?

Quark is preparing a new version of QuarkXPress for this August, and is deliberately looking to one-up Adobe's Creative Suite, according to inside sources for AppleInsider. QuarkXPress 8 is, for instance, expected not only to take advantage of InDesign's continuing instability under Mac OS X Leopard, but to expand support for Illustrator and Photoshop files, and implement standardized B�zier pen tools that may reduce any need for Illustrator in publishing.

To reduce dependence on Photoshop, a new "Picture Content Tool" should allow users to perform basic scaling, cropping and rotation functions on photos. The software is even said to be capable of Flash authoring, so that SWF files can implemented in web layouts.

In an effort to bolster extra adoption, Quark is said to be planning a free upgrade for any purchase of QuarkXPress 7 between May 1st and August 1st. Users of Quark's software are claimed to often linger with older software, particularly as Adobe's InDesign is available for "free" alongside Creative Suite 3.

by MacNN Staff

Post tools:

TAGS :

software, Graphics/Web Design, InDesign, Photoshop, Adobe, Quark, CS3, QuarkXPress, Illustrator

toggle

Comments

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

+1

05/13, 04:16pm | report spam | close Reply |
What???

You mean they're deliberately trying to out-do a competitor? That's a strange thing for a company to do.

jreades
Junior Member

Joined: Feb 1999

0

05/13, 04:38pm | report spam | close Reply |
The war is over, we lost

Sorry, couldn't resist a Battlestar Galactica reference...

Anyway, time was that I used Quark 3.x and 4.x and it was a good application. Beat the pants off of ID 1.x and, at a stretch, 2.x. I liked the Xtensions and the Xtags (great for exporting a database of corporate users and generating business cards in 3 easy steps), and I still sometimes try to use Quark shortcuts in InDesign out of habit.

But as I recall it was something like 3 or 4 years between Quark 6 and 7, the first OS X native release. I simply lost interest when I had to keep firing up OS9 just to run Quark, though I know that some print shops stuck it out simply because that's how they were set up.

I can't help but feel that the one-time leader of the print/press world is now pretty much always going to play catch-up since there seem to be comparatively few people left with much invested in Quark. Presumably the odd print shop that refused to go over to Adobe.

Of course, I could be wrong and would welcome insight from anyone (still) in the field.

kdogg73
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Dec 2002

+4

05/13, 04:40pm | report spam | (1 reply) close Reply |
Too late

Quark had the DTP world by the nads. Unless you completely duplicate every feature InDesign CS3 has, it won't stand a chance. Face it, Quark sucks.

Omek
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jan 2002

-1

05/13, 04:43pm | report spam | close Reply |
Yes, how odd...

I'm an Indesign user and don't really want to learn Quark. It seems like they just keep dragging on... hopefully they'll go down the tubes soon.

eldarkus
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2004

0

05/13, 04:51pm | report spam | close Reply |
it will never...

...replace Photoshop or Illustrator in any way. This is just like a multi-function Printer, scanner, fax, toaster... it does each one ok but will always pale in comparison to the real things...

Monde
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jan 2004

0

05/13, 05:18pm | report spam | close Reply |
Quark was it

Quark was a lot like MS. They, for a while, where the center of the design software universe. Thing is, their CEO was, to be kind, a doofus. Massive layoffs where the reward for Quark software engineers after the last release. Top that with the extraordinarily long time it took for Quark to embrace OSX on which most page design is done, and there you have it-karmic payback.

Quark was okay, but has been massively eclipsed by CS3, which has become the current professional publishing standard for most medias.

The short sightedness of this company's leadership is what did it in. Oh yeah-that karma thing too.

jcatma61
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 2006

0

05/13, 05:19pm | report spam | close Reply |
History.

Not so sad. I remember how snotty they were to Mac users -- their enterprise users, no less -- when we called them on the instability of 4.0.

Quark is history. But let's face it. None of this matters for what we'll have available in a few years. .net products like the Creator Server engine, which no one has heard of, will rule by then. You'll be doing your design in a browser.

Schatz
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2004

+2

05/13, 05:20pm | report spam | close Reply |
Indesign & Leopard

Is ID3 really unstable under Leoprd or are they just regurgitating a Quark press release? Honest question....

Bob

bloggerblog
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Aug 2007

0

05/13, 05:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
Schatz

I'm not sure about being unstable, but ID does have some annoying bugs such as: Option MouseClick on the desktop does not hide ID, but next time you click back on your ID window it might hide you ID app for good. The only way out of this is quitting or force-quitting and re-launching ID.

Quark had some serious attitude and ego issues no one liked them, and I'm glad they're getting stumped. On the other hand, ID needs a legitimate competitor.

UberFu
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2002

0

05/13, 05:41pm | report spam | close Reply |
teh problem w/ Quark...

doing this - their next App version - is that the "functionality" they mention by incorporating Illustration and Photo Editability first:

InDesign Already does this for both types of Apps_

Secondly - neither InDesign or Quark [no matter what Quark spits out next] are geared up to be All-In-One Apps on that level_

As a Graphic Designer I need to have full and complete control and ability to alter anything and everything I want to about a Photo or Illustration - not just color correction or adding a drop shadow_

Even Apps like Lightroom and Aperture are not suitable for mainstream Design Work-flows - but Adobe and Apple got it right and built niche products for Photographers who don't really ned the full power of Photoshop_

Whatever Quark does in the upcoming version - it will not replace Photoshop or Illustrator outright anytime soon_

The best it could hope for is to go up against the likes of Corel's CorelDraw Graphics Suite - that is basically what the Quark blurb is talking about here_

But no way at this point in the game will they upset Adobe's dominance and position in the DTP Market_

There were 2 change overs - OS 9 to OS X and PPC to Intel_

Adobe was aware of this [as was Quark] but Adobe prepped by scrapping their out-dated title [PageMaker] in favor of developing a groundup App [InDesign]_ Incorporated a seamless work flow across it's product line - which when you buy Quark - they don't make Illustration or Photo Editing Software - Adobe migrated quickly to PDF output - which Quark still needed to hack a 3rd party plug-in as their favored method of output thru v7 was to Collect for Output_ Which compiles numerous files and after which you still need another 3rd party App to Pre-Flight the files_ InDesign did this all in the same App and on the fly

Quark missed the boat during the 2 transitions Even tho Adobe spent almost too much time transitioniing from PPC to Intel - they did it right and did it the first time_ Quark v5 - v6 - v7 were all bad copies of v4.x_ v5 we saw them eliminate many built in features and migrate those to plug-in status that you had to purchase for $200� a pop_ v6 should have been the transition to OS X but it wasn't and their excuse was that they were too far into development on the v6 product to migrate to OS X at that time_ This was BS seeing as how before they released v5 [meaning they we still developing v5] OS X was released_ So according to their own logic Quark works on 2 versions of it's software at one time but delays releases for blocks up to 5 or 6 years at a time? I call shenanigans on Quark for that

Anyway - Adobe was looking far enough down the path to take the lead that Quark held for nearly 15 years And by pushing print Houses to uultimately migrate to PDF output instead of the old fashioned Collect for Output [and make sure you have every single scrap of non-sense contained in the collection] - you export a PDF that contains it all for you and ONLY what you absolutely need to reproduce the visuals for final output

CS3 has become the penacle of integrated software titles - rivaling that of Apple's own Final Cut Studio - even tho they are different markets So if Quark plans on integrating Photoshop and illusttrator compatibilty or abilities - they are already behind the curve as they have to make their stuff compatibel and seamless with their rivals Apps

They'll never catch up But they could very well pull a Micro$oft and buy some 3rd party company that already makes Illsutration and Photo Editing Software and incorporate the technology - good luck with that_

Guest
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 1999

0

05/13, 06:27pm | report spam | close Reply |
FreeHand Migration

Some of this looks like a really smart move on Quark's part. There are a large number of people worldwide still running multiple-year-old copies of FreeHand because, for the work that they do, it runs rings around Illustrator (can you say "easy curve manipulation" and "multiple pages"?). With Adobe officially killing FreeHand, this gives those users a migration path to a tool that they may have used at one time. I own and use CS3 Design Premium, FreeHand and QuarkXPress 7. I've used Photoshop since v.2.5 and will continue to do so, but if QuarkXPress can pick up the things I currently do in FreeHand, I almost certainly won't need to upgrade to CS4.

SillyPooh
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: May 2000

+3

05/13, 06:33pm | report spam | close Reply |
Quark will be Quark

For anyone with a little interest in the publishing industry, it really looks like the good old days of Quark...

1_ They don't understand their business
2_ They release moronic new features
3_ They're too late on new technology
4_ They behave with pretentious disdain of everyone and everything, like they own the business and you can't work unless you work with them.

And don't get me started on the bugs.

I used to be a huge Quark user, QPS admin, and developer too. But let's face it: Quark's never been a great SOFTWARE company. Things were good in the beginning, and they sold A LOT, but over time they've never WORKED on their products and tried to improved things at all. Oh they did, just five years in the making, every time! Just like this ability to rotate pics inside picture boxes!!! Hooray! It's pathetic!!

So many Quark projects and products were developed and killed overnight because they didn't have the brains to understand what their users wanted. Wrapture was an interesting product, but their price was way off for anyone, so it didn't sell, so they killed it!

They made huge strategical blunders. Vast amount of time and money spent on tools and features NOBODY wanted. Everyone knew that combining a professional DTP tool with publishing for the web was a huge mistake, but they bet massive on that and lost. Along with their credibility.

I'm really amazed when friends tell me they're still working on Quark. How can you look back when you're tried InDesign? I understand if some newspapers and printing presses still work on it, cause they've been sold those massive expensive systems and everything else was made to work with it. But on a studio level, there's no reason to put up with the stench of Quark.

Adobe has worked well on making inDesign a real solution and have improved PDF a lot, making it an even more serious printing format. They quickly understood the importance of new technologies like JDF and worked out solutions and real working tools. And with a lot of people on board on their technology, like Agfa, they came out the clear winner, even though no one believed Adobe could move the eight-hundred pound gorilla.

Things have changed now, and I don't think people will roll back to Quark, or the company will make a comeback. THEY put themselves in this situation.

Too little too late Quark. Sorry. That ship has sailed.

SillyPooh
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: May 2000

-1

05/13, 06:34pm | report spam | close Reply |
Quark will be Quark

For anyone with a little interest in the publishing industry, it really looks like the good old days of Quark...

1_ They don't understand their business
2_ They release moronic new features
3_ They're too late on new technology
4_ They behave with pretentious disdain of everyone and everything, like they own the business and you can't work unless you work with them.

And don't get me started on the bugs.

I used to be a huge Quark user, QPS admin, and developer too. But let's face it: Quark's never been a great SOFTWARE company. Things were good in the beginning, and they sold A LOT, but over time they've never WORKED on their products and tried to improved things at all. Oh they did, just five years in the making, every time! Just like this ability to rotate pics inside picture boxes!!! Hooray! It's pathetic!!

So many Quark projects and products were developed and killed overnight because they didn't have the brains to understand what their users wanted. Wrapture was an interesting product, but their price was way off for anyone, so it didn't sell, so they killed it!

They made huge strategical blunders. Vast amount of time and money spent on tools and features NOBODY wanted. Everyone knew that combining a professional DTP tool with publishing for the web was a huge mistake, but they bet massive on that and lost. Along with their credibility.

I'm really amazed when friends tell me they're still working on Quark. How can you look back when you're tried InDesign? I understand if some newspapers and printing presses still work on it, cause they've been sold those massive expensive systems and everything else was made to work with it. But on a studio level, there's no reason to put up with the stench of Quark.

Adobe has worked well on making inDesign a real solution and have improved PDF a lot, making it an even more serious printing format. They quickly understood the importance of new technologies like JDF and worked out solutions and real working tools. And with a lot of people on board on their technology, like Agfa, they came out the clear winner, even though no one believed Adobe could move the eight-hundred pound gorilla.

Things have changed now, and I don't think people will roll back to Quark, or the company will make a comeback. THEY put themselves in this situation.

Too little too late Quark. Sorry. That ship has sailed.

revco
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: May 2005

0

05/13, 06:42pm | report spam | close Reply |
Works for me

I'm glad Quark is pushing ahead with XPress. I look forward to the next release.

SillyPooh
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: May 2000

+1

05/13, 06:43pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sorry for the double

... post. MacNN, nice work on the AJAX based comments, but someone ought to put a beachball of some kind next to the submit button to let the user know the comment is being sent.

dimmer
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: Feb 2006

+1

05/13, 08:58pm | report spam | close Reply |
\/\/ ever

"who don't really ned the full power of Photoshop_ "

Nor spell checkers, it would appear.

seabasstin
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2002

0

05/13, 09:41pm | report spam | close Reply |
NOt!

or like they say in New Mexico:
Not Eveeeeeen..!!!

Adobe Sucks!
Quarks Sucks!
its all garbage.

all the Bloato piece of S**** code adobe/Quark et al release is still going to be the suxtor.

Its really high time for real competition to be ramped up in this space.
Whaddya say Apple?
I suggest you take over the Gimp dev just like you did with Konkeror, Samba, and other open source tech, embrace and conquer.
works for MS...

thibaulthalpern
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2008

+1

05/13, 10:54pm | report spam | close Reply |
Oh I remember...

I read Uberfu's comment and agree with a lot of it. Your description is quite apt: "And by pushing print Houses to uultimately migrate to PDF output instead of the old fashioned Collect for Output [and make sure you have every single scrap of non-sense contained in the collection] - you export a PDF that contains it all for you and ONLY what you absolutely need to reproduce the visuals for final output"

I remember in my professional writing (and design) training days, we had to make sure the font, graphic, and PageMaker file were in ONE location so that the print house could accurate reproduce our document. This process was fraught with human errors, and also often computer errors. Sometimes it was the human who forgot to re-generate the output after one thing was changed; another time it's the darn computer program that somehow was not producing the correct files in the appropriate folders. God how I hated that uncertain process.

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

+1

05/13, 11:30pm | report spam | close Reply |
cocoa

Everyone said Adobe missed the boat when it became evident that Carbon is being killed, and they'd have to rewrite into Cocoa. And Quark is (or will be) cocoa. So Quark was going to run away with the market because of Adobe's "short-sightedness" (short-sighted being "We need to get our software out in a reasonable amount of time")

bjojade
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2007

+2

05/14, 10:47am | report spam | close Reply |
Flip Flop

Back in time, PageMaker and Quark were fairly evenly split in the market. Then, Quark ended up taking the lead and was the standard for a few years. Quark got lax and didn't make any significant improvements to their software between versions.

Adobe jumped into the game with a new product, InDesign. While version 1.0 wasn't complete, people were so sick of Quark's lack of support, they jumped ship in droves. Adobe flourished and customers were happy. Recently, Adobe has had serious issues, especially with the delays in getting software updates that WORK. Running CS3 on a Leopard machine is NOT a pleasant experience. There are problems left and right that people run into. Then there's the crazy activation schemes that they are making you do now, which ends up with a call to Adobe every time you work on your machine. People are getting fed up.

Quark sees this as an opportunity to push out a new product that could bring them back into the lead. There are plenty of sites that still use Quark. Plenty more will look at them again because of the Adobe blunders of recent times.

Competition is a good thing. It's what keeps things moving.

bjojade
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2007

0

05/14, 10:50am | report spam | close Reply |
Flip Flop

Back in time, PageMaker and Quark were fairly evenly split in the market. Then, Quark ended up taking the lead and was the standard for a few years. Quark got lax and didn't make any significant improvements to their software between versions.

Adobe jumped into the game with a new product, InDesign. While version 1.0 wasn't complete, people were so sick of Quark's lack of support, they jumped ship in droves. Adobe flourished and customers were happy. Recently, Adobe has had serious issues, especially with the delays in getting software updates that WORK. Running CS3 on a Leopard machine is NOT a pleasant experience. There are problems left and right that people run into. Then there's the crazy activation schemes that they are making you do now, which ends up with a call to Adobe every time you work on your machine. People are getting fed up.

Quark sees this as an opportunity to push out a new product that could bring them back into the lead. There are plenty of sites that still use Quark. Plenty more will look at them again because of the Adobe blunders of recent times.

Competition is a good thing. It's what keeps things moving.

Show More Comments

Login Here

toggle

Network Headlines

05/13	T-Mobile raises down payment price...
05/13	Bill Gates emotionally details final...
05/10	Changes coming to US AppleCare policies...
05/10	USPTO rejects some claims in Apple...
05/10	Apple maintaining waiting list for...

Show All

05/13	New York attorney general asks phone...
05/13	T-Mobile raises down payment price...
05/13	Lumia 925 images leak while Nokia teases...
05/13	Amazon launches Coins virtual currency...
05/13	Bill Gates emotionally details final...

Show All

03/02	Save $330 on refurb. 15.4-inch, 2.4GHz...
03/01	Pre-owned 8GB iPod touch 2G, drops...
02/29	$150 off Nikon Coolpix S80 Compact...
02/28	Plantronics BackBeat 903 Bluetooth...
02/27	Refurb. Seagate 1.5TB GoFlex Portable...

Show All

toggle

QuarkXPress 8 to take dead aim at Adobe CS3?

updated 04:05 pm EDT, Tue May 13, 2008

QuarkXPress 8 vs. CS3?

What???

The war is over, we lost

Too late

Yes, how odd...

it will never...

Quark was it

History.

Indesign & Leopard

Schatz

teh problem w/ Quark...

FreeHand Migration

Quark will be Quark

Quark will be Quark

Works for me

Sorry for the double

\/\/ ever

NOt!

Oh I remember...

cocoa

Flip Flop

Flip Flop

Login Here

Register for our weekly email newsletter:

Connect tools:

Subscribe

to our RSS

Follow us

on Twitter

Most Read

10 Most Discussed

MacNN Marketplace

QuarkXPress 8 to take dead aim at Adobe CS3?

updated 04:05 pm EDT, Tue May 13, 2008

QuarkXPress 8 vs. CS3?

Related Articles

Recent Articles

What???

The war is over, we lost

Too late

Yes, how odd...

it will never...

Quark was it

History.

Indesign & Leopard

Schatz

teh problem w/ Quark...

FreeHand Migration

Quark will be Quark

Quark will be Quark

Works for me

Sorry for the double

\/\/ ever

NOt!

Oh I remember...

cocoa

Flip Flop

Flip Flop

Login Here

Register for our weekly email newsletter:

Connect tools:

Subscribe

to our RSS

Follow us

on Twitter

Most Read

10 Most Discussed

MacNN Marketplace