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Contest won: WinXP boots on Intel Mac

updated 08:40 am EST, Thu March 16, 2006

WinXP boots on Intel Mac

The contest for the first solution to boot Windows XP on an Intel-Mac has been won, according to a post on the official website. The contest had offered a cash reward of nearly $14,000 for the first successful solution, which was subject to three restrictions offered by the creators: (1) Instructions must boot Windows XP (at least), not Vista or any other version of Windows; (2) Windows must be able to coexist with Mac OS X and each system may not interfere with the operation of the other (a traditional dual boot system where one OS is running at a time); and (3) the method must offer the user the option to boot either Mac OS X or Windows XP. The submitted solution was reportedly peer-reviewed for legitimacy and the post said that the final solution will run on all Intel-based iMacs, the MacBook Pro, and the Intel-based Mac mini. While not available now, a post on the user forums says that the solution will be posted shortly along with a downloadable bootloader. The site says that future donations will be used to help support an open-source project that will be launched with the initial solution. Update: The WinXP instructions and bootloader have been posted.

The solution is a bit complicated: it requires the use of Windows PC, creation of a NTFS volume on the Intel-Mac, and the creation of a custom XP bootdisk with some patched files. The instructions include step-by-step instructions and an abbreviated set for advanced users; users note that it would take 20-30 minutes (as well as access to a PC) to complete the process.

by MacNN Staff

(31)

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jasonsRX7
Mac Elite

Joined: Jul 2003

0

03/16, 08:49am | report spam | close Reply |
good!

If they can get this working easily on a MacBook Pro before my Thinkpad T60 ships, I might get the MacBook instead.

rok
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 1999

0

03/16, 09:26am | report spam | close Reply |
hang on...

just because they managed this now doesn't mean it will continue to boot with updates to either xp or mac os x. so if you're going to buy a macbook pro on this story alone, you may be signing up for a whole heaping helping of headache.

but congratulations to the contest winner and sponsor. people get annoyed sometimes by stuff like this, but really, "proof of concept" can drive forward new lines of thought, and from that, hopefully, innovation.

kikkoman
Senior User

Joined: Nov 2002

0

03/16, 09:34am | report spam | close Reply |
yeah

hacks like these tend to be fragile. if you need windows just get the thinkpad already!

Jonathan-Tanya
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2004

0

03/16, 09:46am | report spam | close Reply |
Unqualified comments

With all due respect to the previous posters, the remarks areq unqualified.

Dual bootloaders are a permanent part of the computing landscape. Look at linux. And every new version of windows is supported.

Without so much as a hiccup, in most cases.

So, while it may sound prudent to be cautious, if the posters had actually been familiar with these types of projects, they would know the reality regarding bootloaders which is they are ultra-stable, updated frequently, and around for the long haul.

Rincewind
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: May 2000

0

03/16, 09:50am | report spam | close Reply |
actually...

Hacks like this aren't as fragile as you think. In order to boot Windows (or any other OS) the only software services that you need to track are the boot rom, in this case EFI. Mac OS X has nothing to do with the boot process, it is just another client of that process.

As such, the only thing that could break the process is a firmware update, and even then only if the process used is truly delicate (such as patching the existing boot loader)

Once XP is installed you could delete Mac OS X and have a Windows only box if you really wanted to. If you couldn't that would indicate some dependency on Mac OS X, but that would also violate the spirit of the rules (#2 - that neither system may interfere with the other, even positively).

Jonathan-Tanya
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Joined: Oct 2004

0

03/16, 09:59am | report spam | close Reply |
GRUB

in my post I said look at linux, meaning...look at boot loaders used for linux on x86. GRUB, LILO, et al.

These are not hacks, and they are legitimate programs, developed over years, very stable, very important, etc.

this is a new project, but I wouldn't hesitate to feel secure that on a major platform, such as mac x86, that dual bootloaders won't be a permanent part of the landscape.

godrifle
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jan 2006

0

03/16, 10:27am | report spam | close Reply |
Schwing!

w00t!

that one guy
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: May 2005

0

03/16, 10:36am | report spam | close Reply |
This is good

But I am interseted in something like Virtual PC or Crossover (based on the Wine Project) I would like to be able to run a windows program from within the mac os like crossover or have virtual pc running minimized to quickly call up a windows app. However for gaming this would be cool, I could dual boot windows to play some BF2.

pteson
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Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/16, 10:57am | report spam | close Reply |
Why not a hypervisor as w

1st of all congrats. Good Job. Back in the days when I worked on mainframes we had an Amdahl. The R & D group used to run IBM's VM OS. The production system was MVS. The both ran on the Amdahl at the same time.

This was because there was a piece of SW called a Hypervisor which managed things. I guess this was by saving state of the running OS and switching in the saved stote of the alternate OS.

In those days the Amdahl was very powerful and neither production nor R&D noticed any slowdown in what they were doing.

FWIW production was an APL timesharing system and the R&D was where development went on forthe next release.

Wouldn't it be nice if someone came up with the same thing for the iMac. (Not me though - I'm too old forthe required focussed mental effort ).

godrifle
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Joined: Jan 2006

0

03/16, 11:12am | report spam | close Reply |
Instructions are up

Dual boot instructions are up: http://www.onmac.net/

eldarkus
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2004

0

03/16, 12:10pm | report spam | close Reply |
well...

I'm waiting until I know for a fact that any virus/trojan I get on the PC side will STAY on the PC side. If a virus/trojan starts wiping files from the PC side, will the mac side be protected?

Thats why i'd rather have a virtual PC system, where windows is encased in a safe image... but you know.. something with actual speed! VPC sucks carcer-ridden monkey balls

bhuot
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 2003

0

03/16, 01:00pm | report spam | close Reply |
link is down

The link is down.

appleisgreat
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2006

0

03/16, 02:10pm | report spam | close Reply |
Why should we care???

Frankly, I don't give a damn. I've worked in corporate I.T. for 6 years supporting boy Macs and Windows PCs and I know from experience that Mac OS X far exceeds Windows on every category of performance and security. Windows is c***. Why would anyone wan to cheapen their Mac by installing Windows on it? If I ever HAVE to do something on Windows, I just won't do it. If you can't do something on Mac OS, it isn't worth doing.

zac4mac
Mac Elite

Joined: Oct 1999

0

03/16, 02:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
friggin fanbois...

I've got my MacBookPro at work, a minor violation, but there ARE apps needed for work. Sometimes the apps are company specific and need a PC. Find me a Mac interface to our Instron Compression/tension test frame, or a Mac interface to our surgical generator's serial port etc. I'll put XP on my 'Book as soon as I can. I'll even PAY for XP! I'd rather use windoze on my Mac than play solitaire on this POS Dell.

action
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: Mar 2003

0

03/16, 03:40pm | report spam | close Reply |
can't partition...

hi gang,

per the instructions i cannot format the xp partition as an ms-dos format.

i can format the entire disk as ms-dos but then it won't let me format the osx partition as mac specific.

i'm on a 2ghz macbook pro booting off the cd and the macbook as a target disc.

an insights....

chung lee

LMSinATX
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/16, 05:02pm | report spam | close Reply |
who cares about HW??

As an Apple neophyte, maybe I'm missing something here, but long-term, HW doesn't matter, it's the software... You want to break the MS hegemony and expose everyone to the wonders of OS-X/Tiger and the seamless integration of iLife, why isn't someone working on getting OS X dual-booting on a IBM ThinkPad/Dell Inspiron/Alienware Aurora...??

bigpoppa206
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2003

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03/16, 05:35pm | report spam | close Reply |
One great thing about it

There is no comparing Quickbooks Enterprise Solutions on a PC with the Mac version of Quickbooks. This way I could have one computer at work with all my favorite apps. Now as soon as everything is native, I'm buying!

Matt S
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/16, 06:11pm | report spam | close Reply |
So what ...

Does this mean those who were going to buy Lenovo, Dell, etc., would be better buying a Mac for superior hardware?? Better plug'n'play, better integration ... ?

Monstermind
Junior Member

Joined: May 2000

0

03/16, 07:19pm | report spam | close Reply |
Woo-ha!

Gives new meaning to the phrase "dual-boot Mac".

Thinkenstein
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Sep 2005

0

03/16, 10:20pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sociological Wonder #1

Someone who would buy a Mac and want to defile it with Windows.

jvalentinus
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/16, 11:26pm | report spam | close Reply |
This *is* a bad thing

Has it occurred to anyone that if booting Macs on Windows becomes commonplace, this will cause certain software developers to stop development of their Mac apps? Why bother making two versions of the software when you can always boot that Mac into Windows? The incentive to maintain Mac versions will disappear.

Of course, there is a simple way to counter this: release OS X for non-Apple PCs. People will buy it in droves, tipping the marketshare back towards OS X, and therefore the incentive to develop Mac apps.

bigpoppa206
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2003

0

03/17, 12:52am | report spam | close Reply |
*THAT* is a bad thing

Keep Apple software proprietary! Don't try to do the Microsoft thing and license the OS to every Tom, d*** or Harry out there. Then we'll have all of their problems and lose the exact reason why we love Macs.

ianwarner
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/17, 09:53am | report spam | close Reply |
muscle car

Someone likened installing XP on apple hardware to buying a corvette and removing the steering wheel, automatic windows, severing the brake lines and deflating your tires. There are things that just shouldn't happen - this is one of them! I understand its use for experimental purposes, but not as a permanent solution. This should *not* be an easy way out for software developers. We need to support OSX software development, not hinder it!

ticedric
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2003

0

03/17, 10:49am | report spam | close Reply |
history

if you look at apple's record, we can expect monthly "updates" to prevent booting.

madcow
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2000

0

03/17, 06:53pm | report spam | close Reply |
Hey alright,

Next lets see if we can get a lawn mower engine to power a Porsche. From a geek perspective I can appreciate this but any one who would run XP over OSX on a day to day basis is a moron.

jvalentinus
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/18, 02:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
*that* is a bad thing

I simply meant that if developers drop the Mac, Apple could fight back by licensing their OS to PC users. This is an Apple's only ace up their sleeve now that they've started building Wintel machines. Doing it now would be immensely stupid.

How long before Apple pulls a Palm and starts offering Windows on their Macs? Like Palm, they could say how superior their hardware is, and their just providing a better Windows XP experience. Yuck.

Why oh why did they start building Wintel boxes running OS X? I thought at least it would have some proprietary hardware that would keep XP from booting.

ApeInTheShell
Senior User

Joined: Nov 2002

0

03/19, 11:14pm | report spam | close Reply |
Attack of the Clones

Apple did license their operating system to other computer manufacturers (Power Computing, UMAX). When Steve Jobs came back in 1997 he pulled the plug because the clones took away money from the Apple high-end market. I do not think this is innovative and great for the Macintosh community. In fact, if Apple chose to offer Windows XP or Mac OS X for their Intel Macs than the former would win because everyone is familiar with Windows. Thus, people would not see the advantage of having a Mac over a PC other than its hardware design. This would kill the Macintosh platform in a heart beat.

IvoryTower
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Mar 2006

0

03/20, 09:59am | report spam | close Reply |
Bad thing?

IMO, no. First off, this was a contest to see who could successfully hack Windows to run on Intel/Apple hardware. It was not funded or supported by Apple, Microsoft or Intel. If it had been an attempt by any of the aforementioned companies to destroy the Mac OS surely at least one of them would have been involved. Could this hack or others like it lead to such a scenario? Possibly, yes. Liklihood, low. For a lot of folks, the Mac OS is superior and more people are finding that out. Switchers and multi-platform users are REAL!

Secondly, why would anyone buy Apple/Intel hardware to run ONLY the Windows OS? Admittedly Apple HW is sexier than most, but that alone doesn't justify the higher price. Only a person with more money than sense would buy a MBP over a similarly equiped Dell JUST to run Windows. Mac users pay a premium to use the Mac OS ... not the hardware.

mapleman
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2006

0

03/20, 03:26pm | report spam | close Reply |
xp on mac

so let's see....first you buy the best-designed computer in the world, which is also running the best OS in the world, then you waste a bunch of time installing a maddening, swiss-cheese operating system, and call this a victory. Hello?

z10n
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2003

0

03/21, 04:30pm | report spam | close Reply |
Give it up already

God, I've never seen so many cool-aid licking fanboys in all my life. There are plenty of perfectly good reasons for wanting to install windows next to OS X:

(1) Games. (2) Proprietary software. (3) Better software. ("Gasp!" Alright then, you stand there and tell me that the version of Quicken for the mac is better then the windows version. Go ahead and tell me.) (4) To have only one development box. (5) Just to play with "the other side"

And so on. If you don't care about windows or you think it sucks, then go on through your merry life in OS X, and stop bitching. Nobody is forcing you to download this hack. The way I see it, it saves me the $1500 I'd have to fork up to buy a Dell so I can play Half Life.

Now, will people suddenly stop developing for the mac because this exists? Um, no. 95% of fanatical mac users who have refused to switch to windows up to this point will NEVER switch to windows, no matter what. So that market will always exist. Also, 95% of users, when given a choice, typically stick with the ONE OS they know the most. Even with this hack, I'd say the majority of people will spend most of their time in one OS or the other. In other words, this hack is for geeks and tinkerers, not for the general (mostly-ignorant) public. If apple was shipping dual-boot machines, it would be a different story. But the aren't, and they aren't going to authorize anyone else to do it either. That means the only people who will know about it are the geeks that frequent sites like macnn. The majority of people just won't know.

tsmelker
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Feb 2006

0

03/24, 05:59pm | report spam | close Reply |
Mac poser?

Who invited the Windows poser? Seriously, z10n, why would you want to use a PC to play games, when there are plenty of stable console game systems already- with more on the way? And yes, there are better software editions on the Mac vs. the PC- Microsoft Office 2004 for Mac has better and more features than the PC version- and it's made by Microsoft, for cryin' out loud! Never mind the fact that Apple has always had the best applications first- what platform did Illustrator, Photoshop, Word and Excel come out on first? The Mac OS, of course, especially since Windows didn't exist then!

And by the way, just in case you think I don't know a thing about the Windows platform, consider this- I was a PC user for years before I switched to the Mac platform, and I'm glad I did. I'm writing this on the Dell Dimension 4600 that I'm forced to use at work- and even with its 2.36GHz processor and 1GB or RAM, it still can't outperform my 6 year old PowerMac G4 at home- with its dual 450 MHz and 896 MB of RAM- and I can STILL play games on my Mac!

Lastly, what makes you think that computers are all about gaming? Most people I know who own Macs are more concerned about the work they can get done, and how fast they get it done. That's why they use Macs- because they are professionals and they can afford them.

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Contest won: WinXP boots on Intel Mac

updated 08:40 am EST, Thu March 16, 2006

WinXP boots on Intel Mac

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good!

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