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http://www.macnn.com/articles/05/04/04/ipod.killers/

TIME looks at iPod's faults, iPod "killers"

updated 03:35 pm EDT, Mon April 4, 2005

iPod killers?

A Time article looks at , many of which claim to offer more features and better reliability than Apple's iPod. On the "iPod-killer" list are Sony's NW-HD3 Network Walkman, Toshiba's Gigabeat MEG F20, the iRiver H10, and the Zen Micro. The article claims consumer interest in iPod alternatives stems from the iPod's "notorious lack of endurance" between recharges and sealed case that means you may have to "scrap the thing" if the internal battery dies. Moreover, the article suggests the iPod's "proprietary digital-music format" joins users "at the hip to Apple's iTunes online store." The article says competitors are "delivering fetching new digital-music players that adopt some of the benchmark's strengths while offering more flexibility and features."

by MacNN Staff

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mitchell_pgh
Posting Junkie

Joined: Feb 2000

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04/04, 03:40pm | report spam | close Reply |
iPod Killer

Official iPod killer Article #827,736,107,204
(Yet the iPod continues to grow)

medmuse
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Nov 2002

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04/04, 03:50pm | report spam | close Reply |
UhHuH

Yep. the iPod is junk. Doesn't work. $100.00 disposable battery. No WMA. No stopwatch. Shuffles don't have a 5" color screen linked to a satellite HD network of first run movies. It will never sell.

discotronic
Mac Elite

Joined: Oct 2003

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04/04, 03:55pm | report spam | close Reply |
Scrap if the battery dies

That is a very misleading thing to say. The battery can be replaced very easily. Newertechnology makes a replacement battery for every model of the regular iPod. It is only a matter of time before they have one available for the mini.

GORDYmac
Mac Elite

Joined: Dec 1999

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04/04, 03:59pm | report spam | close Reply |
Don't follow it up

This article was paid for and submitted by none other than Sony & Microsoft.

Buying the media...it's not just for politics anymore.

spacefreak
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Joined: Feb 2002

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04/04, 04:02pm | report spam | close Reply |
Lame

How dare a periodical, let alone TIme, mention that there are other players with different features that don't forbid users from buying online music from all but one place (iTMS).

l008com
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04/04, 04:02pm | report spam | close Reply |
ya

Who has heard of any of those killers? Yes i believe its 50� that has a U2 black ipod in his latest video :-)

the_13th_saint
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04/04, 04:06pm | report spam | close Reply |
misleading...

The simple fact that you can rip your own CDs to play on your iPod and have a choice to using Apple's "proprietary digital-music format" and being tied "at the hip to Apple's iTunes online store." is blatantly ignored by this article.

You are in no way required to use the store to purchase your music.
You are in no way required to use Apple's "proprietary digital-music format"
The iPod plays back many different formatts including Apple Lossless, AAC, AIFF/WAV and of course MP3's (which are completely cross platform and work on nearly all portable music players).

benhur
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04/04, 04:07pm | report spam | close Reply |
only a matter of time

the ipod hasn't changed all that much since it's beginnings. Well, okay color screen, and capacity. The price has finally come down. What if Apple put some of the "ipod killer" features on the iPod? End of story. Game over. I just wish Apple would do it and be done with it.

jpellino
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04/04, 04:12pm | report spam | close Reply |
wake me...

when any one of them sells 4.5 million units in a quarter...

slider
Mac Elite

Joined: Oct 1999

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04/04, 04:13pm | report spam | close Reply |
Well, here's the thing

If Apple starts to lose ground in the MP3 market and/or the RIAA makes legal downloadable music undesirable to where iTMS is no longer with maintaining for Apple, all Apple needs to do is release a firmware enabling WMA or open up it's codec. But this is not the time, I suspect Apple has a close eye on this market and will do what it needs to do to ensure the continued success of this money maker. Apple knows what can happen by being narrow mind from experience, but that does not mean you give away the store and don't maximize the profits on concept, that would just be irresponsible.

riverfreak
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: Aug 2001

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04/04, 04:16pm | report spam | close Reply |
Yet another...

Yet another uninformed article. Should we expect anything less from the American media? Apparently, the people who write these articles never learned how to do research. And don't get me started on their ability to ask questions (except for Jeff Gannon - aka hotmilitarystud - that guy knows how to go for the jugular).

benhur
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04/04, 04:17pm | report spam | close Reply |
re: here's the thing

I agree. That's really the point. How willing is Apple to adapt and is it willing to learn from being narrow minded.

I love my iPod, but I'm using it more as a portable hard drive rather than a music player. I was actually hoping there was truth to the Shuffle Pro. I know, I know. It wouldn't work with the iTunes store, it is not an Apple product so automatically it's an inferior product but I'm really wanting features that I don't know if Apple will ever put on their iPods. I just keep hoping Apple will be the one to make the next iPod killer.

stukdog
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Joined: Feb 2005

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04/04, 04:23pm | report spam | close Reply |
something is wrong

You know it's a bit of a sign when I had to actually look up each of the other players by name to even see what they looked like. The press writes all the want, but most people just want a player that plays music. they don't care about other features. They don't care about what the file types are. the majority just want something to listen to. That is why the ipod is really as good as any other.

resuna
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04/04, 04:30pm | report spam | close Reply |
You see the price drops?

Did you see the price drops on flash players after the iPod Shuffle was announced?

I didn't. Not for the "name brands" anyway. I was just at Frys looking for a case for my Shuffle (none yet) and they were pushing a 256M WMA player for $150. I couldn't believe it.

There's obviously SOME market for the stupid things, or they'd be selling them for something more reasonable.

pascalpp
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Joined: Nov 1999

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04/04, 04:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
Also

Rock n roll is noise pollution. Elvis encourages our children to have premarital s**, and the Beatles encourage experimental drug use. And and and.

bobolicious
Junior Member

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04/04, 04:31pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sound quality is key...

...for me and until others offer lossless codec I will stick with the pod - I don't buy aac source music from ITMS for the same reason - still ripping CDs - the PSP has my attention however & why Apple hasn't gone for the movie option still disappoints me, but perhaps they were shut out by Sony's distribution coup...?

Squirrel_Monkey
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04/04, 04:37pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sloppy journalism

This article reveals an unfortunate truth: journalists can be as lazy as anyone. This also means they can be easily persuaded to fall into the "iPod killer" camp or the "iPod is king" camp. What happened to some degree of objectivity and thorough research? I suppose those two things won't do in today's "get the story first, not accurate" media. (I believe Windows Media Audio format also falls under "proprietary.)

What I find most amusing about the article is how the author often unwittingly reaches the conclusion that the iPod line offers to best features for the best price. The author seems to be writing in circles just to get to the final pun that appears to be the genesis of this article: "There's more than one way to peel an Apple."

testudo
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04/04, 04:43pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: here's the thing

If Apple starts to lose ground in the MP3 market and/or the RIAA makes legal downloadable music undesirable to where iTMS is no longer with maintaining for Apple, all Apple needs to do is release a firmware enabling WMA or open up it's codec.

First, what does enabling WMA have to do with any of this? Apple would need to open the iPod to decode WMA if they lose ground in the iTMS to other stores. Beyond that, it doesn't make a difference (if the iPod stops selling tomorrow, adding WMA will only help sales IF its because people want WMA support).

And doesn't anyone see a problem with no one mentioning that, hey, guess what, that whole WMA experience is completely and utterly tied to Windows. I mean, as mac users, we're screwed even if the iPod could do WMA.

testudo
Forum Regular

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04/04, 04:55pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: sound quality

...for me and until others offer lossless codec I will stick with the pod - I don't buy aac source music from ITMS for the same reason - still ripping CDs - the PSP has my attention however & why Apple hasn't gone for the movie option still disappoints me, but perhaps they were shut out by Sony's distribution coup...?

Are you saying that most of the other players out there don't support lossless formats? I didn't realize that.

As for the movie option, it'd be a 'look at this cool feature' option, but until we can download movies (can we do that yet? No. Oh) or be allowed to copy movies from DVD to the iPod (can we do that yet? No either, damn!), then what in the h*** use is a movie option? So I can see my nephews 5th birthday party over and over again? Yeah, that sounds scintillating.

As for the PSP, they have a much larger screen for movies, plus you have to get them separately on disc (mini disc, not hard disc), so, what, you're still carrying around loads of stuff. And maybe I'm missing something (I might be, I've given the PSP about as much attention as I do anything else Sony comes out with), it doesn't even seem like there's a hard drive in there, it just uses Sony's "breakthrough" memory sticks. (What is it with Sony? They're worse then Apple. They come out with some tech that only they use, and they just won't give it up. They've got memory sticks AND mini discs in this thing. And it probably only plays ATRAC music to boot - nope, I just checked, they actually allow MP3s on this as well, no other formats though).

I have a hard time saying its an iPod killer when I can't take all my music (20GB at this point in time) with me.

trevc
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04/04, 05:09pm | report spam | close Reply |
RE: RE: Sound quality

Apple doesn't have to start with MOVIE capabilities. I'm sure that's a WHOLE lot more complicated than doing deals with the record labels.

They CAN however support H.264 (?) and do 'SMALL' clips like music videos with the music. It fits with the 'music' theme, doesn't cross the line totally into the MOVIE world, introduces a new totally cool feature that will sell more iPod Colors and give Apple an experimenting ground in delivering video content on that platform.

It's kinda like the Sony Walkman, people still call it a walkman, but don't care if they get a Sony or a Apple, cuz they do the same thing. Apple has to be 'just' on the curve (not necessarily ahead). I believe they're there now and prices are comparatible with the rest, just that they HAVE to keep it up and everyone has a different idea of what they want to see.

NeonGE
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Joined: Dec 2004

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04/04, 05:20pm | report spam | close Reply |
Worst. Article. Ever.

Okay... so for the price of a NW-HD3, you can get an iPod photo. It has 50% more space, a color screen and better support for open standards but with half the battery life. Cnet wasn't a big fan of the "menu that's easy to navigate using a four-way directional button". In fact, they said it was just the opposite.

As far as the H10 goes, I don't see any advantage over the iPod mini whatsoever.

JoshFofer
Junior Member

Joined: Nov 1999

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04/04, 05:25pm | report spam | close Reply |
mini-movies

I'm with trevc. I don't necessarily want to watch a whole movie on my iPod. Even a 23 minute sitcom would be pushing it. But it certainly would be cool to download a music video from the iTMS (heck, charge me $1.99 per video!) so I watch/listen to THOSe.

Auto-sync to 30 of the latest movie trailers and I'll be your best friend. :-)

spacefreak
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04/04, 06:14pm | report spam | close Reply |
RE: misleading

[i]"The simple fact that you can rip your own CDs to play on your iPod and have a choice to using Apple's "proprietary digital-music format" and being tied "at the hip to Apple's iTunes online store." is blatantly ignored by this article.

You are in no way required to use the store to purchase your music.
You are in no way required to use Apple's "proprietary digital-music format""[/i]

You are the one who is ignoring the fundamental premise.

An iPod owner who wants to buy online music for immediate download can only use iTMS. That's right... no saving money at other vendors like Wal-Mart, and no option to use subscription-based services.

I am so sick of the Steve-Jobs-is-God crowd constantly supporting Apple's closed system with the same old, lame-a** argument that essentially amounts to: "You're not limited... you can get into your car, drive to a music store, buy a cd, drive home, open the cd, put the cd in your computer, and rip it".

testudo
Forum Regular

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04/04, 06:28pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: mini movies

I'm with trevc. I don't necessarily want to watch a whole movie on my iPod. Even a 23 minute sitcom would be pushing it. But it certainly would be cool to download a music video from the iTMS (heck, charge me $1.99 per video!) so I watch/listen to THOSe.

Wow, people actually watch music videos still? Thought those died in the 90's when MTV decided music videos didn't fit their whole concept of a music network. But once you get past the "oh, cool, look what my iPod can do, I don't see it as a 'killer' feature. If anything, Apple could add it just to force the 'ipod is dying' article writers to come up with other things to whine that it doesn't do. Although I'm sure they'll add "Its too difficult to watch videos, the navigation isn't obvious, and the screen is so tiny, what's the point?").

And while its nice that everyone's crowing about Apple's quicktime and H.264 and how great video will be and all that, keep in mind it ain't been released yet, and I've read very little except rehashed Apple PR statements about its quality, scalabiltiy etc. To me, until QT7 comes out, and H.264 encoding/decoding becomes possible, its all just a bunch of Apple vaporware. I remember all the hubbub when Apple added streaming capabilities to Quicktime, and how it was going to be so great, and, to this day, it still generally sucks. Promises are easy, implementation is hard (and is anyone else a little concerned that QuickTime 7 is getting so little play by Apple or anyone else when it comes to these great new features and capabilities?)

iamnoone
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04/04, 06:48pm | report spam | close Reply |
Oh Please spacefreak

what I am sick of, spacefreak, is people like you who think that apple needs to cater to every single cheap a** person on the planet!! It will never be good enough for people like you because even if they did open up the iPod to the "crapmart" crowd you'd find something else to b**** about....You are no more or less limited with the iPod then you are with any other player out there......if you want walmart, then get another player and download all the cheap(and censored music I might add) you want....I am also sick of people like you who act like a little cry baby and start calling people names when others don't agree with you...grow up....just because the people here don't agree with the article doesn't make any of us Steve Jobs worshipers...in your logic then, that would make you a Bill Gates worshiper because you don't agree with everything apple does...normally, I don't respond to trolls like you, but you caught me on a bad day...now git!!

MisterWizard
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04/04, 06:50pm | report spam | close Reply |
Testudo

You think that Quicktime is bad??? Then Windows Media and Real are bot Real Real Bad. Quicktime is always smooth and responsive for me, Can't say the same for the others.

MisterWizard
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04/04, 06:53pm | report spam | close Reply |
Spacefreak

You go right ahead and by that cheap crappy sounding WMA files from your so-called discount vendors. I don't care - I just prefer to have a greatsounding mp4

spacefreak
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04/04, 07:25pm | report spam | close Reply |
Chill, folks.

Sure enough, some in the Steve-Jobs-is-God congregation missed the point.

For the record, I never said I wanted WMA files, or that I wanted to buy from Wal-Mart. As a matter of fact, I am one of those who insist on buying the actual CDs.

What I was pointing out was that, despite Apple fans claiming it's not a closed system, it is closed and restricted if the matter at hand is the online purchase and download of digital music.

If you like being restricted, that's fine. If aac files sound better to you than wma (like you'd know), all the power to you. But don't pretend like, as an iPod owner buying music online, you actually had a choice as to where to buy and download your music. You didn't.

There's nothing "so-called" about these "discount vendors", but I realize that, as an iPod owner with no option to actually partake in these services, you probably have no idea.

The iPod is a great player, and it's integration with iTunes is stellar... the best around. However, don't let that blind you to the fact that you are restricted as to where you can buy your online music. You can only buy downloadable music from Apple for whatever price they mandate you pay.

SpaceMonkey
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04/04, 07:28pm | report spam | close Reply |
Not just ITMS

Technically, you're not just limited to the iTunes store. There's also emusic, which offers DRM-free mp3s.

spacefreak
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04/04, 07:52pm | report spam | close Reply |
eMusic is cool...

Good call, though they only offer non-major label music. THere's also a Russian site that offers downloads in numerous formats for pennies.

The major labels are the reason for DRM. I'd just like to see Apple open it up a bit... maybe license it, or be compatible with WMA files. Then none of this would be an issue. It would never come up in articles or in sales propaganda put out by competing player manufacturers.

aer
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04/04, 08:55pm | report spam | close Reply |
actually

you aren't limited to just iTMS with the iPod. there is this GREAT russian website that has 224kbps AAC files of every artist out there and entire albums are like $2.50. (shhhhh!!!)

bigpoppa206
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04/04, 09:39pm | report spam | close Reply |
Errr....

That Russian site is for illegal downloads. Your wallet may like it but your karma won't.

And for the person who said the iPod does not support lossless formats....WAV and AIFF files are lossless and it supports them doesn't it?

LouZer
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04/04, 11:18pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: misleading

An iPod owner who wants to buy online music for immediate download can only use iTMS. That's right... no saving money at other vendors like Wal-Mart, and no option to use subscription-based services.

Well, unfortunately I'm a mac user. What does that mean? Well, it wouldn't matter what format Apple supports with the iPod, since WMA DRM isn't supported on the mac, mac users are still screwed and stuck with their limited options, no ability to buy from Walmart, no ability to use a subscription service. Again, why aren't people complaining about that! No, its "you buy an iPod, you're stuck with iTMS", not "you want to buy from any other store, you're stuck buying a PC and using Windows".

Oh, and if you want to buy from a subscription service, you're very limited on the players you can use to play their music. Very few now handle that DRM.

bigpoppa206
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04/04, 11:58pm | report spam | close Reply |
Formats Update:

iPod shuffle supports MP3 (8 to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, AAC (8 to 320 Kbps), Protected AAC (from iTunes Music Store, M4A, M4B, M4P), Audible (formats 2, 3, and 4) and WAV. All other iPod models support AC (16 to 320 Kbps), Protected AAC (from iTunes Music Store), MP3 (16 to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, Audible (formats 2, 3, and 4), Apple Lossless, WAV, AIFF

MisterWizard
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04/05, 02:02am | report spam | close Reply |
Spacefreak

Seems to me that windows media is a closed format as I can't even buy those on my Mac... Thank god

blidd
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04/05, 02:32am | report spam | close Reply |
The article does explain

why the iPod sells better just read the intire article because the ends tell why the iPod dominate. When you read trough the article you will see how some of them have better claimed battery time (An iPod will also have a better battery time if you incode in 64kbit thank you very much sony) But we will not be satisfied with the sound Quality. Neither will the people buying the Sony. The iPod does not have han fm radio. Will I have mine because I want to hear my own music collection. All those extra features are things that in the mind of the competition ought to win people over. We have a larger collection of music stores to choose from. True, but the all use the same Windows DRM and the all sell the same songs roughly. iTunes Music store has the same number of songs if not more. It is a lot easier to understand your rights and it is a lot easier to us. It is so easy that people that hate Apple uses iTunes for windows to handle their music collection simply because it is the best.

macnavi
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04/05, 05:18am | report spam | close Reply |
11th april???

How can you trust an article which already lies about its publishing date? The article is published with the wrong date, 11th of april... At least, here in Denmark it's the still the 5th.

Btw, Steve IS God.

macnavi
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04/05, 05:29am | report spam | close Reply |
Still buy an iPod

Hm, what's the fuzz actually about. After reading the article, a as "neutral" user, I would have the idea that an iPod is the way to go, because it sets an example for the others. It's cheaper, it's ease-of-use interface apparently is something others TRY to live up to.

Why is this... er, 'limited' battery life such a problem? I only once run out of battery power.

iPod rules.

ptsenior2000
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06/23, 09:20pm | report spam | close Reply |
PSP and Minidisc

Actually, the PSP uses UMD not minidisc. It would be much better it the PSP used a minidisc format rather than UMD. Speaking of which, I don't know why people never bring up minidisc when talking about the "IPOD Killers". The only leg up the IPod has on minidisc is the harddrive, since MDs now support MP3 playback. The only problem with MDs is you can only upload on a windows machine.

However, for the price of an Ipod mini, you get the same features, AA or rechargeable battery, plus more space if you so desire AND Mic input recording ability.

http://www.minidisco.com/mz-rh910.html

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TIME looks at iPod's faults, iPod "killers"

updated 03:35 pm EDT, Mon April 4, 2005

iPod killers?

Related Articles

Recent Articles

iPod Killer

UhHuH

Scrap if the battery dies

Don't follow it up

Lame

ya

misleading...

only a matter of time

wake me...

Well, here's the thing

Yet another...

re: here's the thing

something is wrong

You see the price drops?

Also

Sound quality is key...

Sloppy journalism

Re: here's the thing

Re: sound quality

RE: RE: Sound quality

Worst. Article. Ever.

mini-movies

RE: misleading

Re: mini movies

Oh Please spacefreak

Testudo

Spacefreak

Chill, folks.

Not just ITMS

eMusic is cool...

actually

Errr....

Re: misleading

Formats Update:

Spacefreak

The article does explain

11th april???

Still buy an iPod

PSP and Minidisc

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