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http://www.macnn.com/articles/04/12/15/apple.copying.microsoft/

Apple copying Microsoft?

updated 09:40 am EST, Wed December 15, 2004

Apple copying Microsoft?

In an and has been since Steve Jobs returned to Apple: "Spotlight's biggest claims to fame, presumably, are its near-instant search results and support for document meta data, both of which are, again, planned features of Longhorn. But no matter. While Apple has been busy copping Windows features since Jobs returned to Apple in late 1996, the company's tiny market share ensures that very few people will benefit from Spotlight, despite Apple claims that it will deliver on desktop search a year before Microsoft ships Longhorn." Microsoft's MSN Toolbar Suite is available now as a public beta and will ship in the first quarter of 2005 as a free product, according to the report.

by MacNN Staff

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David Esrati
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 1999

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12/15, 09:50am | report spam | close Reply |
"search on windoze"????

I've got a couple PCs in the office- I have a bunchh of Macs- the oldest mac can search an 80gig drive for a file in a second- all our windows machines- running the latest OS- and "faster" processors- 2.8 ghz- take an eternity to just find a word doc.
Apple has had Windows beat in search from day one. I don't know how they could be copying M$- what's this guy smoking?

burger
Forum Regular

Joined: Sep 2000

0

12/15, 09:52am | report spam | close Reply |
Windows?

What is this amazing Windows, and how can I buy one?

johnny66ch
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Joined: Mar 2003

0

12/15, 09:58am | report spam | close Reply |
Who cares?

I care only about improvements in efficiency. To be able to get things done quicker, more intuitively and in less steps. Think workflow.

I don't really care about what is planned for Longhorn. I'll only believe it when I can use the new features productively. But I already can test spotlight on the Tiger builds, and this will rock!

wooster
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2003

0

12/15, 09:59am | report spam | close Reply |
Paul again

This is not his first attack on Mac OS X on M$ behalf - the guy is probably as fugly as Steve (monkeyboy) Ballmer and has no friends :-)

cmoney
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: Sep 2000

0

12/15, 10:00am | report spam | close Reply |
a request

all comments about thurrott should begin with "what an a**."

isn't it funny that a company can copy features and then release them a full year ahead of the company that originally created them?! i'm sure a** thurrott will next claim that quartz extreme is copied from longhorn as well, and apple released that what, 2-3 years in advance of longhorn? maybe isync was copied from some windows technology that's coming in 2010, which is probably the year of the release after longhorn.

oh and watch out world, apple copied .mac from microsoft too. in 2014 windows users will get similar benefits!

turtle777
Clinically Insane

Joined: Jun 2001

0

12/15, 10:07am | report spam | close Reply |
Mwahahahaha

Paul Thurrott is such an IDIOT !
It's beyond comparison.

csimon2
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2000

0

12/15, 10:07am | report spam | close Reply |
Who would want to...

This type of thing is exactly why I could NEVER become a more than on-occasion Windows user. Sure, Longhorn MAY offer lightning fast search results, but if I have to open a separate app to do so, then how is that any more efficient than Sherlock? Apple's approach of blending in the search app as a contextual top menu is exponentially more efficient and useful to me.

Roehlstation
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Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 10:09am | report spam | close Reply |
Introduction

Pot, this is Kettle....Kettle, this is Pot.

JohnnyFive
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Joined: Feb 2003

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12/15, 10:11am | report spam | close Reply |
How much?

Did Microsoft pay him to regurgitate their press releases and repackage it into a news article/feature?

Come on Paul, if you care so much about Apple plagiarizing Microsoft, you at least owe your readers a laundry list of which features were copied and when. I think you're just looking to incite a libel suit from Cupertino.

Visnaut
Senior User

Joined: Nov 2000

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12/15, 10:12am | report spam | close Reply |
Cry me a river

"the company's tiny market share ensures that very few people will benefit from Spotlight, despite Apple claims that it will deliver on desktop search a year before Microsoft ships Longhorn."

It's sad that one who purports to be a journalist can write such bitter comments. He so 'despises' the Apple platform that he wants to reassure himself with the overwhelming number of Windows-using sheep will never know that Apple has an edge over Windows.

What truly surprises me is how anyone, much less a tech writer, can be so spiteful to what amounts to a computer platform. What's the point? People use the tools that are best suited to them, leave it be. He seems to me like one of those poor souls who never fully grew out of puberty and still has the incessant need to prove himself and his choices to everyone, and attempt to insult and drive into the ground those who respectfully disagree.

I pity him, I really do...

dave a
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Joined: Jan 2002

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12/15, 10:14am | report spam | close Reply |
Apple IS copying...

From OS 9's version of Sherlock...and from their own "quick search" using UNIX Locate...

overbyj
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Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 10:15am | report spam | close Reply |
Why is this on this site?

Why is anybody giving any attention to Paul Turdrot? This guy is a complete MS lackey. I am sure he would willingly be a recipient of a Bill Gates teabagging. Please don't feed this troll!

Jonathan-Tanya
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Joined: Oct 2004

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12/15, 10:16am | report spam | close Reply |
I'm copying both

I have to apologize, but when I was born in 1969, both Steve Job's and Bill Gates were already alive...presumably breathing the air and eating food.

I copied both of these traits in order to sustain myself. I breath oxygen and eat food on a daily basis.

I apoligize for being such a copy cat.

On the other hand, I think it's important for Apple to keep placing obvious advancements into the operating system...they'll just have to take the criticism for being too good.

shortcipher
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Feb 2001

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12/15, 10:21am | report spam | close Reply |
noone copied anyone

I dont think anyone copied anyone, except perhaps MS with their slogan "find anything, anywhere, fast". The idea of a desktop integrated search and file meta data is hardly new news, both companies have clever people working for them and I'm sure both are capable of coming up with the same idea completely independently. If anything they both copied Google, or to be more accurate, were inspired by Google.

LordJohnWhorfin
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12/15, 10:24am | report spam | close Reply |
What an a**

I find such a blatant display of sour grapes hilarious. Apple has been copying Microsoft, see, but they do it in such an insidious manner that they always manage to release the stuff years before Microsoft does. That's how good they are at copying.
For instance, Apple had multiple monitor desktop spanning more than 10 years before Windows had it, but that's only because they stole it from Microsoft who had planned it 20 years ago.
What an a**!

shortcipher
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Feb 2001

0

12/15, 10:25am | report spam | close Reply |
and another thing...

If anything the fact that MS and Apple are both working on the same ideas is a good thing, it makes the switch from PC to Mac slightly less disorienting, users are most comfortable with what they are used to, regardless of what is actually more usable, so the fact that these tools are so similar to each other is a good thing for switchers.

gambit-7
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Joined: Feb 2001

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12/15, 10:26am | report spam | close Reply |
BWA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

*splutter, splutter, cough... deep breath* Bwwwaa-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Oh god.... oh god. I'm crying from laughter. Whew!

Attention everyone who's keeping score:

Dvorak now has competition!

Whew! That was a good one. I think I'll read that article again, just for more giggles.

Musti
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Jan 2001

0

12/15, 10:28am | report spam | close Reply |
Is that you?

John C. Dvorak? Is that you?

mike3k
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Joined: May 1999

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12/15, 10:31am | report spam | close Reply |
Nobody believes him

Why do you bother giving him more publicity than he deserves? If we ignore him maybe he'll give up.

gambit-7
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Joined: Feb 2001

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12/15, 10:34am | report spam | close Reply |
Supplemental...

On a serious note, that guy is simply delusional. "Apple copying MS since the return of Jobs?" WTF? Shall we remind him of XP's blatant, yet poorly executed GUI ripoff of Aqua? Even the NAME XP came out after Apple decided their next OS was to be named X. (But, Xp stands for eXperience, right? *cough*) How about MSN Music store? The list goes on and on, but...

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Oh man! This guy's funnier than Kramer!

bobolicious
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2002

0

12/15, 10:41am | report spam | close Reply |
Certain aspects of X...

...continue to surprise me at being more & more windows like - as I get to know windows having been virtually forced to buy one - or continue to use OS-9 because Safari still can't properly display a surprising number of websites correctly...

Little things like copying & pasting disks, directory forwards & backs, and then there is the dock, which quite frankly whether you believe NEXT started it or whatever, exists in W98 & has been tarted up nicely for X... It would make any transition for a Windoze person easier - but OS-X seems far more windoze like to me than OS-9 ever did - too bad OS-X still can't display a website properly or offer the simple integrated database functionality (incuding CSV import/export) that the standard Outlook can in Windows...

X has some beautiful features, but it is harmonizing with & still doesn't work as well as XP (basics like email/browsing), at least in my personal experience...

tuscmat
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12/15, 10:42am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: Supplemental...

No man, XP= Xtra Plagirism.

milhouse
Senior User

Joined: Jan 2001

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12/15, 10:42am | report spam | close Reply |
What an @ss...

I am almost stunned at such ignorant hubris... Yeah, Micro$oft... such a history of independent "innovation"...

His artilce is laughable.

vickys-box
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Joined: Apr 2004

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12/15, 10:46am | report spam | close Reply |
Wow!

This is simply extraordinary. M$ are only releasing their desktop search tool because Longhorn is delayed and they need to shout "me to" to keep Windows users placated until it finally ships.

Wait till Spotlight comes out in Tiger. It will change the way we work.

macimmortal
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Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 10:46am | report spam | close Reply |
OMG

I seem to have fallen asleep on December 14th and awakened on April 1st. No? It has to be April 1st. Someone tell me I'm wrong.

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 10:52am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: a request

isn't it funny that a company can copy features and then release them a full year ahead of the company that originally created them?!

Not surprising at all. With only 73 users (and quickly falling), its easy to pump this code out, because you can skip the stuff your infitessimally small user base needs. MS, however, needs to support EVERYONE!

maybe isync was copied from some windows technology that's coming in 2010, which is probably the year of the release after longhorn.

Umm, iSync is a blatant rip-off of that hugely popular and well utilized software on the Windows platform called "Briefcase". Duh.

i'm sure a** thurrott will next claim that quartz extreme is copied from longhorn as well, and apple released that what, 2-3 years in advance of longhorn?

Quartz Extreme is a blatant but subtle rip-off (hey, can you be blatant AND subtle?) of DirectX! That's right folks! MS had high-end graphics long before Mac OS X came out with quartz extreme! h***, even the name was basically taken from MS. Since ever I've used windows, its always came with that most important piece of productivity software, Solitaire. And what is solitaire? A card game. And what suit do you find in a deck of cards? Diamonds. And what is a diamond? A crystalized rock. Just like, OMG, Quartz! Geesh, its right in front of your face, people!

You people are just such zealots. I mean, everything you see on the Mac, you know they stole from Windows. h***, turn on a mac, and what do you see? A boot screen. Gee, just like Windows! And then you get a login screen, with little pictures next to people's names. Just like Windows. And you got 'fast-user switching', just like windows (although windows doesn't have any of that time wasting 'animations'!). And when you log in, you get a desktop with a bar at the bottom, just...like...windows. Now, get this. In windows, if you double-click a program's icon, it starts up that program. I just tried this on my Mac. Yep, you guessed it, it starts up the program.

And you all are missing the bigger picture here, as well. When you use the Mac OS, you get inundated with all these new features all at one time, year after year. In the Windows world, they slowly trickle out the new features, so you can get used to their ideas and how they work, without wondering what else you might be missing. Pretty smart, those MS folks.

mitchell_pgh
Posting Junkie

Joined: Feb 2000

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12/15, 10:55am | report spam | close Reply |
Paul Thurrott's

The difference between Microsoft and Apple is Microsoft shows features even when they don't/can't include them with the OS and Apple delivers.

Paul Thurrott is anti-Mac. Just read some of his comments on his "internet-nexus". http://www.internet-nexus.com/

He positions OS X against Linux when it favors Linux and positions OS X against Windows when it favors Windows.

SteveTech
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Sep 1999

0

12/15, 11:00am | report spam | close Reply |
A GUI is a GUI

When will journalists come up with something new when comparing Apple to Microsoft. This one copied that and they copied this. Good Grief! Almost 20 years and this c*** is still going on.

presearch
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Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 11:01am | report spam | close Reply |
Rip offs

Anyone that's familiar with NeXT machines can see that
when it came time to create an interface look for
Windows 95, Microsoft directly lifted from NeXT.
The expand and close boxes at the top corners of the
windows, the start bar as a poor imitation of the Dock,
even the look and layout of dialog boxes with use of
empty space, a sans serif font and the gray bevel boxes...

M$ was ripping of Jobs well before he returned to Apple.

What I'd like to see from Apple in this coming year is
to start comparing Mac OS X to Windows and compare it
to driving an Olds Cutlass.

"Mac. It's not your Dad's computer!"

horvatic
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Apr 2002

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12/15, 11:10am | report spam | close Reply |
PT making up fairy tales

The Mac Daily News has the facts at this link below.
http://macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/4472/
Apple has been working on spotlight for over 3 years and maybe if Paul
would actually find out the facts before making up his fairy tales he wouldn't be laughed at all over the world.

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 11:11am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: certain aspects

and then there is the dock, which quite frankly whether you believe NEXT started it or whatever, exists in W98 & has been tarted up nicely for X...

Well, the dock was started at NEXT. And the dock in OS X is nothing like the win98 taskbar. Its more like the Windows XP one, where windows for a like program show up as just one icon. The windows taskbar is nearly useless if you keep many windows open (as they just show up as small little icons without any idea what each is) or get grouped together (a feature I turned off in XP, because it wasn't an all-the-time setting, but changed depending on whether your windows fit in the task bar or not, so one minute your three word docs are right down there separate, then you open the calculator, and now to switch between word docs, you have to go hunting through some sub-menu).

You know, in OS 9, users seemed to whine about how much better the start menu and task bar were in windows. Apple gives you it, then you complaints against it. The ol' "Can't win either way" scenario.

It would make any transition for a Windoze person easier - but OS-X seems far more windoze like to me than OS-9 ever did - too bad OS-X still can't display a website properly or offer the simple integrated database functionality (incuding CSV import/export) that the standard Outlook can in Windows...

Well, OS 9 was getting long in the tooth, and it needed to go. The biggest and best thing Apple did when they made OS X was not follow some mantra of "Keep the OS 9 Finder". No offense, but most people are put off having 20 windows open trying to track down a file. Or having to do that to open an application.

And Outlook isn't a standard part of Windows. Outlook Express is, but that's a completely different beast (h***, they have the same name, but look nothing alike, and can't even share files, you have to import/export to get mail from one to the other). Not sure what you mean by 'simple database integration'. Address book doesn't do it for you? It supports vCard import/export (which Entourage doesn't do easily, mind you), the standard for data exchange for that type of data (CSV, people still want that?). What other 'simple database integration' does Windows offer that I'm missing? (BTW, you'll notice that MS doesn't use Apple's integrated address book, wonder why that is).

X has some beautiful features, but it is harmonizing with & still doesn't work as well as XP (basics like email/browsing), at least in my personal experience...

Well, on the browsing front, it sure does help that MS gained a monopoly share of the browser market, allowing oh-so-many websites to code to IE 'standards', rather than just following standard 'standards'. Nah, I'm sure that has nothing to do with it.

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 11:18am | report spam | close Reply |
Couple more things

"Spotlight's biggest claims to fame, presumably, are its near-instant search results and support for document meta data, both of which are, again, planned features of Longhorn.

Actually, I believe there's a big differnce underneath this tech. MS's idea was for WinFS to store all data in a big database, rather than a file-system, and then be able to search/store/link/index stuff through this database engine. Apple isn't changing the file system, they're tacking on indexing (and, speaking of that, doesn't both Apple and MS allow indexing drives and content now? What's the difference between spotlight and Longhorn over Sherlock's indexing and Fast File Find?)

But no matter. While Apple has been busy copping Windows features since Jobs returned to Apple in late 1996, the company's tiny market share ensures that very few people will benefit from Spotlight, despite Apple claims that it will deliver on desktop search a year before Microsoft ships Longhorn."

You know, the guy has a point. Don't you all realize that, because of the Mac's tiny market share, how much we're missing out on great software like Spyware, Adware, Viruses, etc.? The Windows users get all the benefits, dagnabbit!

Microsoft's MSN Toolbar Suite is available now as a public beta and will ship in the first quarter of 2005 as a free product, according to the report.

Does that mean I won't need to get Longhorn for the search capability, because MSN Toolbar search is free for me to use? Cool! Thank's MS for saving me all that money.

beeble
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Joined: Mar 2004

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12/15, 11:24am | report spam | close Reply |
Testudo

I can't quite tell whether you're being sarcastic or serious. There are some things that are wrong in your comment and they seem to be defending Microsoft and there are others that are so wrong they seem to be mocking Microsoft in a very sarcastic way.

Just wondering where you stand on this.

For the record, MS does need to support everyone. That's because they make the OS with the most bugs and security holes. On the other hand Apple and Mac support staff worldwide don't need to work anywhere near as hard as their PC counterparts because the Apple's stuff works.

iSync and Briefcase have little in common. I really can't see what you're talking about there.

Direct-X is comparable to OpenGL not Quartz Extreme. Direct-X and OpenGL are 2d/3d graphics APIs that are used by programers to create software such as games. Apple has had OpenGL and Quicktime3D before it for a very, very long time. There is no equivalent of Quartz Extreme on any other platform. Rather than having the CPU render the 2d graphics in the computer for the regular display of interface elements such as buttons, menus and windows, Quartz Extreme hands that task over the GPU which when not using OpenGL based programs (mostly games) is completely idle. The GPU is a processor on the graphics card that is purpose built to process and render 2d and 3d graphics and having it idle 99% of the time in 99% of the computers out there is a waste. Quartz Extreme hands this work over the to GPU thereby freeing the CPU for other tasks it's more suited to.

Then it seems you get into mocking Windows by saying that "everything you see on a Mac, you know they stole from Windows" which is kind of funny because it took 11 years for Microsoft to have the interface that Apple in 1984. When I turn on my Mac I see an Apple (I used to see a little Mac smiling back at me). On PC's I see text and numbers, very stylish.

On my Mac I have a bar across the bottom just like OS X's predecessor (which is also much older than Windows), NeXT OS which Apple bought the rights to. And again, since 1984 I've been able to double click a program and have it start on a Mac which I've been able to do on a PC since 1995 (well several years before that if you count OS/2, the best PC operating system to date).

Again I'm sorry if you meant sarcasm but the first half of your comment didn't sound sarcastic at all while the second half did. Unfortunately, without voice inflection, it can be difficult to tell if someone is being sarcastic or not. But just in case, I wanted to set the record straight on some things you said which didn't make any sense.

jreades
Junior Member

Joined: Feb 1999

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12/15, 11:52am | report spam | close Reply |
Uh, BeOS?

Aren't *both* companies copying BeOS -- MS by trying to turn the entire filesystem into a searchable database, Apple by just hiring the BeFS developers to implement an extensible metadata search facility on HFS? Of course, Apple is making this even more useful by adding the ability to use third-party plug-ins to search the *contents* of a file and not just the metadata.

I still feel it's a shame that Be offered all of these tools more than five years ago but still managed to go under. I also seem to remember a demo on my university campus where Be (or was it Next?) had a dual-processor machine (called the BeBox, IIRC) that actually allowed you to swap out processors without a restart -- you could shut down the processor using software tools, replace it while the machine was running, and then restart that processor and the OS would keep ticking over.

Of course, this was back in 96 or so, so I may be no longer remembering correctly what they were hot-swapping... apologies if I've gone off the deep end.

bearfilm
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Joined: May 2001

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12/15, 11:59am | report spam | close Reply |
Windows Copies Apple?

First, you guys took all my good sarcastic comments, so technically you are all copycats since I thought of them first but you guys posted them for everyone else to read befire I had edited my thoughts well enough to publish this.
Second, as a long time Mac User, I do wish Apple would quit copying MS let's face it...Tiger will just be a carbon copy of Longhorn and we will all realize this sometime in the first half of '05 and will be able to demonstrate Longhorn to all PC users as they wait for their version to be released sometime in '06 (Hopefully! crosses fingers)
At least that makes up for the wait in Games as I think we all use the OS on a daily basis.
Third and final point, have a Happy Holidays!

tdellos
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12/15, 12:06pm | report spam | close Reply |
Re: Uh, BeOS?

If Apple is "ripping off" any pre-existing OS' search functionality, it is the BEOS', not the fictional Longhorn's.

If you follow this link:

http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/07/2225239&tid=179&tid=3

You can read all about how Dominic Giampaolo (who worked on BEOS) is the brain behind Spotlight, and how spotlight works (hint: there may be more than one reason Tiger includes ramped-up SQLite support).

Of course, I would think a "good technology-reporter" could do some basic research on a topic he was going to report on. But it looks like Thurrott (or not so thorough) is just shooting from the hip here. I'm not sure if that means I have a misconception of a what a "good technology-reporter" is, or if it means Paul is not a good technology reporter. I leave it to the fair and unbiased MacNN readers to decide.

ender
Junior Member

Joined: Mar 1999

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12/15, 12:26pm | report spam | close Reply |
Copying

Thurrott's concept of copying apparently is that whoever HE hears the idea from first MUST have been the first person to come up with the idea. Since he is MS's lackey, he hears about *future* MS technology before he hears about *actual* Mac features. So in his self-centered universe, Apple is copying MS.

macslut
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12/15, 12:33pm | report spam | close Reply |
Here's my favorite...

I had to skip to the bottom to avoid busting a gut from all the funny antics early on in the article. Get this:

"But wait, that's just the beginning. Maybe you're using the new MSN Search beta to find out information about your favorite musical group. If you search for that band's name, the first link on MSN Search (Figure) will direct you to MSN Music, from which you can find out more information, or even buy music, which is kind of amazing."

OMG, you mean MSN Search puts advertisements for MSN Music in the search results!!! Who was the brilliant engineer who invented that technology? Hey, and it's right up on top of my search results, so if I wanted to find information on a band instead of finding music I can buy from MSN Music, where I would've done my search if I wanted to buy music, I can instead search with MSN Search and scroll past the advertisements for MSN Music and then get information...that is amazing!

Or as he goes on to say, "This is revolutionary stuff."

salmonstk
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Joined: Apr 2004

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12/15, 12:43pm | report spam | close Reply |
More Important Point

Besides who copies who I have a bigger complaint with his statement that no one will benefit from Spotlight do to small market share. That is like saying in the 50's when they first came out with better TV cameras no one would benefit because hardly anyone had a TV.

If its a great product like it is, a better product like it is, then BUY ONE!! and You can benenfit. This doesn't hold in computers only because M$ is a monoply and has a stanglehold on the customer. What other product can you think of where the basic defense is that you can't switch so ANY improvement in the locked in product is so much better than an alternative.

Gorloth
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2001

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12/15, 01:27pm | report spam | close Reply |
Copying M$ values

Lets hope Apple doesn't copy M$ stock prices ;)

OpenStep
Senior User

Joined: May 2001

0

12/15, 01:46pm | report spam | close Reply |
Copland

Anyone remember when something similar to Spotlight exsisted in some of the Copland developer previews?

VadersCape
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12/15, 02:06pm | report spam | close Reply |
Funny!

This guy makes me laugh more than Dvorak! He's funny because he doesn't know he's funny. Sort of like the Batman TV series in the 1960's or Archie Bunker. If they ever realized what asses they were, they'd stop being funny. But with this guy, I don't think there's going to be any danger of that anytime soon.

bsaxton
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Joined: Jan 2000

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12/15, 02:16pm | report spam | close Reply |
Competition

Apple and MS are competitors. They are competing.

koogz
Dedicated MacNNer

Joined: Nov 2004

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12/15, 02:19pm | report spam | close Reply |
I would love

to see his sites go down from some sort of internet attack. Not that I'm condonind such behavior or calling for it, I'm just saying it would be funny to see the "Truth" splattered on his site for once.

Can't someone make this guy at least provide sources for his idiotic rants? What a fcuking loser.

Unregistered Us
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Joined: Dec 2004

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12/15, 02:39pm | report spam | close Reply |
you all crazy

Tiger, Longhore, all vaporware as long as it is shipping.

Lookout (now owned by Microsoft but is still free (as in gratis), Google Desktop, and Yahoo desktop search (soon to be released, licensed from X1) - all do a better job than the CURRENT search functionalities in Windows, Apple, and Linux.

I don give a f*ck who copied from whom. Who is shipping the best product today matters more to me.

bfalchuk
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Joined: Jul 2003

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12/15, 02:39pm | report spam | close Reply |
Are you kidding?

Does he think such major search innovations from other companies can be built in just 2 months? He's a f****** MORON. No, the reality is that Google and Apple have been working on this stuff for a long time. It's not like only MS knows how important searchability is. If anything, Google knows that far better than MS. So you can't just say that everyone who does search is copying MS. What a f****** moron.

smurphy
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Joined: Dec 2004

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12/15, 03:05pm | report spam | close Reply |
The real story

Here's what's really going on:
Microsoft knows they have to come up with something really different to give people a reason to stick with them, so they come up with the IDEA to have a database that everything lives in that'll be really easy and fast search.

Then since, as we all know, Microsoft can't actually invent or innovate anything, they announce that the technology won't be coming until 2006. This fools Apple into seeing this as a window of opportunity to beat Microsoft to the punch, when in reality it allows Microsoft to have Apple do all the interface work to make this thing usable, then Microsoft just has to come in and steal the interface!!

Obviously I'm joking, but it makes you think "What if it's true...?"

gambit-7
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Joined: Feb 2001

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12/15, 03:15pm | report spam | close Reply |
Hmmm....

After reading all these posts (and laughing out loud, thanks all!), let me just pre-empt his next article with this response:

Yes, you got blasted but not because we're all 'Mac Zealots' or 'Apple Worshipers.' You got blasted because you truly are an idiot.

On that note, isn't it funny that when a PC-reporter 'reports' something that is so blatantly off that they couldn't have possibly done any research and then get called out by Mac users, they always say that it's Apple users being zealots and fanatics?

Oh well.

ecrelin
Junior Member

Joined: Oct 2000

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12/15, 03:30pm | report spam | close Reply |
Gates is the DEVIL�

Callous lies and deceit, constant empty promises from the overly rich, out of touch leaders, all the while their ignorant minions echo. A familiar historical ring no?, ha ha ha ha ha ha, ah ha ha ha ha ha ha. Rome is burning Mr. Thurrott! Linuxians and Unixterians and their spawn (OS X et al) are at the gates, oh gosh, unavoidable pun, and you fiddle on. Who cares that many a Roman fell on a sword that "looked like" one of their own, it wasn't and they died anyway.
Intel's having some yield/performance/core engineering problems with it's ItAintHappenin, I mean Itanium, AMD is eating their dead but can't possibly shoulder the weight of that market. The Power5 is on the march and M$ doesn't run on it. IBM doesn't want to play in the windoze sandbox anymore because the handwriting is on the wall (and its filled with cat p***). Any IT exec who decides on new Wintel servers in this or next year's budget cycle based on the "promise" of LongShot's rapidly shrinking feature list is a moron. As the IT closet goes, so goes the desktop, years are flying by and big dumb giants fall hard (Ballmer?), M$ will be an also ran or less soon, Let's talk again in 2010.
Maybe technology innovation can get revitalized without the profit yoke of the M$ brass and all their hangers on. Long live *nix!!!!! Ah ha ha ha. Oh, and don't let the door hit you in the a** on the way out.

snapjack
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Joined: Jan 2002

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12/15, 03:38pm | report spam | close Reply |
Jealous

Windows is in decline, everywhere you look people are looking for alternatives. The press is full of coverage on everything Apple does, when is the last time you read something, other than Longhorn being delayed, about MS?
These windows lackies are jealous and lashing out in their predictably lame way. Apples rolling and these guys can't stand it. Pityful really, competition is good for everyone, but they can only see Apple getting all the attention and that just chaps their Balmer looking asses.

gambit23
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Joined: Nov 2004

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12/15, 05:24pm | report spam | close Reply |
re: jealous

"These windows lackies are jealous and lashing out in their predictably lame way. Apples rolling and these guys can't stand it. Pityful really, competition is good for everyone, but they can only see Apple getting all the attention and that just chaps their Balmer looking asses."

Actually, I'm gonna have to disagree with you on this one. I think Windows users, and everyone who dislikes Macs in general, I think they're put off by Mac users' attitudes. Think about it: we're always telling them that our stuff is better than theirs, so we really do come off as snobs. Because it's true only adds to the notion, and it really DOES push people away who otherwise wouldn't mind trying a Mac out.

There's a certain smugness about a Mac user that can get annoying to some people. Especially if we're right.

tabarnak
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Joined: Jan 2003

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12/15, 05:29pm | report spam | close Reply |
lol

reminds me of those redneck saying farenheit 9/11 is just lies after lies after lies!

testudo
Forum Regular

Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 05:32pm | report spam | close Reply |
Hey!

Missed this initially:
But no matter. While Apple has been busy copping Windows features since Jobs returned to Apple in late 1996, the company's tiny market share ensures that very few people will benefit from Spotlight, despite Apple claims that it will deliver on desktop search a year before Microsoft ships Longhorn."

First off, this supposes Longhorn will ship in 2006 (anyone want to lay bets?). Second, wasn't the whole integrated searching feature of Longhorn pushed until later, along with almost everything else that made Longhorn 'new' and 'different', like the new graphics engine and the WinFS file system? Didn't Gates even say that Longhorn wasn't so much as a single release, but a longterm goal that could take several years and updates to fully evolve?

Makosuke
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Joined: Aug 2001

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12/15, 05:34pm | report spam | close Reply |
Har

People have said it well here; MS does some decent things, Apple does some decent things, other companies do some decent things and often before either (BeOS, for example). MS copying Apple on these features, however, is ludicrous, and the statement about Apple copying MS since Jobs' return is pure fantasy no matter how much of an MS fan you are--Jobs may be very attached to all the stuff he brought in from NeXT, but just because that sometimes looks Windows-like doesn't mean it's all copied.

I had to comment on this, though...

Comment posted by: bobolicious:
[i]...as I get to know windows having been virtually forced to buy one - or continue to use OS-9 because Safari still can't properly display a surprising number of websites correctly...[/i]

Huh? Safari isn't perfect, but using OS9 instead of X because it's better for web browsing is like using a piece of coal instead of a ballpoint pen because it's better for writing.

Your choices on OS9 are basically NS4, IE5, Moz1.2, and iCab. Three of the four run better on X, and all but one border on useless on 80% of modern web pages. Meanwhile you have Opera 7, Moz1.7, Firefox, Safari, and the same IE5 on OSX. Heck, NS4 will even run in classic.

The only browser bordering on modern that OS9 has is the aging Mozilla 1.2, where X (and Windows) have the latest versions that run MUCH better. IE5 is a rather lame browser at this point, but if you like it it runs better on X anyway.

That only leaves you with NS4, which is perhaps required for some microscopic fraction of badly designed, archaic websites, but is nearly useless on any modern page and at

MAlan
Mac Enthusiast

Joined: Oct 1999

0

12/15, 06:41pm | report spam | close Reply |
NeXT

How can people like this write such things in such utter and complete ignorance of basic history. NeXT computers...Hello!!

speedraycer
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2002

0

12/15, 08:46pm | report spam | close Reply |
Does this mean...

That Ford copied Chevy when they installed sunroofs in their cars?

Unregistered Us
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Joined: Dec 2004

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12/15, 09:14pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sigh....

[i]"Apples rolling and these guys can't stand it. Pityful really, competition is good for everyone, but they can only see Apple getting all the attention and that just chaps their Balmer looking asses."[/i]

Please learn how to write and not make all Apple users look like idiots.

JEB
Junior Member

Joined: May 2001

0

12/15, 11:24pm | report spam | close Reply |
BWAAHAAHAAHAAHAAA HAAAAAA

HAHA HA AHA AHAHAHAH
HAAHAHA A AA A AHAHHHAA
HAHAHAHA

*COUGH*
*GOUGH*

good one, now pass me a swig of that to wash down what we been smokin'

ahaaaah ahahahaha hahaha!!!!

rkadowns
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Aug 2001

0

12/16, 01:57am | report spam | close Reply |
Re: LOL

Yeah, and it reminds me of all those lefty FREE-SPEECH advocating, fudge packing, baby murdering, religion abolishing, we don't care what you think as long as you think like us, faggots that shut down the broadcast of Stolen Honor screaming lies, lies, lies too!

Okay, so can we now get past the name calling and throw away the sour grapes? Nov 2nd is old news.

Back on topic, did NeXTStep have indexed, system-wide searching similar to spotlight or msn search? I don't understand the NeXT history comment by MAlan.

I've test driven Google desktop and I am not impressed. I just installed MSN search this evening and will test drive that a while. First impressions are that I feel like I just intentionally installed Gator. Reminds me too much as something written by spyware makers. As far as I know, it's Cain & Abel on the backside. I'll be impressed if I can type tcp/ip properties and have it open the actual properties tab. Something tells me it won't but I will know more tomorrow. If Apple is going to be accused of copying these features, they are going to have to suck as bad as these.

Also, for those that want a taste of a bit of Spotlight, check out Quicksilver. http://quicksilver.blacktree.com/

It's hard to live without it once you get used to it.

coolfactor
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Jun 2003

0

12/16, 07:59pm | report spam | close Reply |
rip off

I downloaded MSN Toolbar Suite to try out the Search feature. Given that Apple demonstrated Spotlight publically, Microsoft has had plenty of time to create something similar in the meantime. Who's copying who?

z10n
Fresh-Faced Recruit

Joined: Oct 2003

0

12/22, 12:05pm | report spam | close Reply |
Sigh

Articles like this one drives me crazy.

Were you born? Did you go through life? Then guess what? YOU COPIED SOMEONE ELSE. You copied your parents when you learned how to walk and talk. You copied your teachers when you were in class. You copy your mentors, you copy your friends. EVERYONE LEARNS FROM EVERYONE ELSE.

So what is the point of all this "Apple was first!" or "Microsoft was first!" BS? In case anybody hasn't figured it out yet, BEING FIRST DOESN'T ALWAYS MEAN YOU ARE THE BEST. Worrying about who was first just distracts you from what you should be doing, which is making your product the best it can be NOW! While you spent all your time thinking about the past, your competitor focused on the present, and they are BEATING YOU because of it!

People remember firsts, but they USE what is best for them right now! That's where you make your money. Not by constantly drumming up the past.

nielsonp
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Joined: Apr 2005

0

04/02, 12:18am | report spam | close Reply |
reply to that mac fan

the bloke who said his mac searched through an 80 gig hdd faster than windows has never heard of google desktop search. it indexes you entire hdd and doesn't take long to search

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Apple copying Microsoft?

updated 09:40 am EST, Wed December 15, 2004

Apple copying Microsoft?

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